Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

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Big Mac
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Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Big Mac » Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:04 pm

I was wondering what could be done for Clerics of Stratis.

If I'm not imagining it, there was a 3rd Edition Forgotten Realms book that gave rules for Clerics of a deity that was dead in the 3rd Edition Realms.

I know that Spelljammer has that year-and-a-day ritual for bringing a foreign deity into a crystal sphere. And I know that a similar ritual got mentioned in a Forgotten Realms novel. But I think that there was something where Clerics of a deity could work as cultists or somesuch.

Does anyone recognise that?

I think there was also a thing with Clerics of Bane switching to Cyric...or vice versa. And I think there was supposed to be another deity who murdered a deity and pretended to be that one.

EDIT: According to Forgotten Realms Wiki Leira was murdered by Cyric, who then pretended to be her.
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Boneguard » Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:14 pm

In 2nd edition you had no spell and no turn undead. In the case of Waukeen when she was missing but before her portfolio was picked up, the cleric only had access to 1st and 2nd level spells and turn undead. No specialist priest though.
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Big Mac » Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:47 pm

Boneguard wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:14 pm
In 2nd edition you had no spell and no turn undead. In the case of Waukeen when she was missing but before her portfolio was picked up, the cleric only had access to 1st and 2nd level spells and turn undead. No specialist priest though.
That sounds like a good way to do things.

I guess that would translate to no Clerical Domains and no 3rd Level spells or above, for 3rd Edition D&D. :)

Can you remember what book you read that in, Boneguard?
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Boneguard » Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:45 pm

Big Mac wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:47 pm
Boneguard wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:14 pm
In 2nd edition you had no spell and no turn undead. In the case of Waukeen when she was missing but before her portfolio was picked up, the cleric only had access to 1st and 2nd level spells and turn undead. No specialist priest though.
That sounds like a good way to do things.

I guess that would translate to no Clerical Domains and no 3rd Level spells or above, for 3rd Edition D&D. :)

Can you remember what book you read that in, Boneguard?
Yes, it was in the old Forgotten Realms Adventures hardcover, created to bridge 1st and 2nd edition.
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Seethyr » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:04 am

I remember there were some kind of priests of dead gods - a prestige class or something called the Ur-Priests? Was that in the Book of Vile Darkness ?

Edit: Nope, looked it up, thinking of the wrong 3e book - Ur Priests worshiped no god, not dead ones. Perhaps it was in the Lost Empires of Faerun book.
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by Seethyr » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:17 am

Here we go, it was a feat I was thinking of from Lost Empires of Faerun:

Servant of the Fallen

You keep alive the worship of a deity who has died or vanished. Your faith in this fallen deity allows you to wield divine magic in his or her name.

Prerequisites: Cleric level 1st, dead or forgotten god (for example, Amaunator, Bhaal, Moander, or Myrkul) as patron deity.

Benefit: You can name a dead god as your patron deity
and still receive your cleric spells normally. In addition, you can call upon the universal remnant of your deity’s power once per day to gain a +1 luck bonus on any single die roll. You can also be raised or resurrected normally.

Normal: Dead or fallen deities cannot grant cleric spells, so clerics who choose such patrons do not normally receive spells. Characters who do not worship active gods in Faerûn suffer the fate of the Faithless in the Fugue Plane after
death.

Special: You can take this feat only once. Choosing this feat changes your patron from your previous deity to the dead or forgotten deity of your choice, and you take no penalties for making this change. If you later choose a different patron deity, you lose the benefit of this feat, but your new patron may grant you spells just as he or she would for any other cleric.
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Re: Can anyone remember the rules for clerics of dead gods?

Post by ripvanwormer » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:42 am

Big Mac wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:47 pm
Boneguard wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:14 pm
In 2nd edition you had no spell and no turn undead. In the case of Waukeen when she was missing but before her portfolio was picked up, the cleric only had access to 1st and 2nd level spells and turn undead. No specialist priest though.
That sounds like a good way to do things.

I guess that would translate to no Clerical Domains and no 3rd Level spells or above, for 3rd Edition D&D. :)

Can you remember what book you read that in, Boneguard?
This was premised on the idea from 1st edition's Deities & Demigods that 1st and 2nd level spells came from a cleric's own knowledge and faith, and required no deity. This is also why clerics in spheres where their gods are unknown can still regain 1st and 2nd level spells in Spelljammer. Deities & Demigods went on to say that 3rd, 4th, and 5th level clerical spells were granted by the servants or minions of a deity, rather than the deity directly, except in the case of demigods. Demigods granted 3rd-5th spells directly and were incapable of granting higher-level spells. 6th and 7th-level spells were granted directly by the gods, and only greater deities could grant 7th level spells.

3rd edition, sensibly, jettisoned the idea that clerics should be penalized for choosing less powerful deities as their patrons.

From 3e's Faiths and Pantheons, page 5:

"The constant clash of deities also ensures a steady supply of dead deities whose temples now lie in ruin about Toril. Moreover, death doesn't necessarily end the career of a deity of Toril. The possibility of resurrection always exists, as evidenced by the recent return of Bane. Small cults dedicated to the resurrection of one lost deity or another appear everywhere in Faerun. Sometimes the deity is beyond the reach of such cultists or never existed except in myth, and its adherents receive no divine backing in their endeavors. Other times, a dead deity retains enough power to provide divine backing to a handful of worshipers. Occasionally, another deity masquerades in the guise of a dead deity, in hopes of expanding its portfolio."

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