Tempus Fugit - Moving BR forward?

[Arawn76]

Disclaimer: I don't personally see the need to advance the timeline if your not introducing the new races and realistically I don't know whether Wotc would release BR without them (if they will at all).

Should Wotc release Birthright 4E , do you think they should advance the timline?

Whatever your answer why? And if yes how much? And what would you do if you advanced it?

[Arawn76]

Crap idea to get you started it took me a whole three minutes to come up with this (and it shows), but hopefully it will shame somebody with talent into having a go.

This advances the timeline 50ish years

Rage of the Gorgon

551 years after the fall of Michael Roele that event which most Anuireans feared above all else happened. The Gorgon began his war of conquest! After years of preparation the armies and monsters of the Black Prince Raesene made swift and terrible inroads to conquering the divided Anuirean states, with no organised opposition and no single or small alliance of Anuirean realms able to match his military might his victory seemed assured.

Six months into his campaign however a charismatic military leader named Aedric arose, with a powerful Anduiras bloodline this hitherto unknown Warlord united the different realms and made powerful alliances with both the Tuarviel & Sielwode Elves as well as soliciting aid from the Rjuven & Brecht. A bloody 2 year war of reclamation followed until finally the Gorgon was forced back to the Gorgon's Crown.

The Second Shadow War.

Gathering his allied forces Aedric prepared to end the Gorgon's threat once and for all, sadly this was not to be as his old friends the Elven archer Mearen & dwarven crossbowman Brana brought news that a great darkness had covered the lands to the west and a force of undead, pale shadow men and demon men had laid waste to (?????), led by the Cold Rider. Gathering his exhausted forces and sending out spies Aedric turned to face this new threat only to find himself outmanoeuvred at every corner. Seemingly able to traverse the Shadow Realm at will the Riders forces could be anywhere and everywhere. After five long years Aedric determined that the only hope for victory lay in destroying the enemy headquarters at (??????), coupled with his discovery that the cold rider was the god of evil Azrai reborn and the demon men were descendents of Adurians that had worshipped him he wasted no time in moving forward with his plan.
Surprising Azrai with his boldness Aedric's forces smashed into the unprepared enemy, however even with the surprise betrayal of the Adurians, who hated their master as much as they feared him the battle soon turned against the Aedric’s forces. As all hope seemed lost and Aedric fell before Azrai's dark blade rays of light pierced the darkness and destroyed the undead, drove away the shadow men and gave even more of the proud Adurians the strength to defy Azrai. The gods had once again taken the field of battle.
Determined not to make the same mistakes that had resulted in their forebears destructions and sensing that perhaps Azrai could not truly be destroyed whilst evil existed ,and he was able to draw on the Shadow Realms power the gods had planned and waited till Azrai was at his most vulnerable. As Azrai's attention was on his mortal foe the gods completed a ritual to restore the shadow realm to its original wild and fey state and banish Azrai and his followers living and dead from that place. Having no desire to see those followers or Azrai dominate the mortal world this ritual also transformed Azrai into a new plane of existence, diffusing his power and mind and locking it forever as the place where the Shadow fell, banishing his followers to its cold embrace.

The next 50 years.

Much has changed in the last 50 years with a strong Adurian (Tiefling) realm rising where the domains of (????) once stood, many kingdoms have vanished and appeared as borders shift and change and allegiances are made. In Khinasi a new race has been discovered the Dragonborn of the dragon isles, this young and militaristic race are rare as yet but have already established a small domain bordering both Anuire and Khinasi and trade and fight with equal aplomb. And amongst the common folk, well amongst them a dream of a unified and peaceful Cerilia still exists and hope of a hero to achieve it.

[Idabrius]

Here's my question: why would the Gorgon ride now, after thousands of years of not doing so? There are a great many theories as to why the Gorgon doesn't simply crush all of Cerilia (since he's, yaknow, an unstoppable monster with a huge sway of vassal-states) so if the Gorgon DID ride forth, I'd be interested in knowing what caused him to.

What I think might be more interesting is examining the advancement of the core states of Cerilia like Ghoere and Medeore.

[Arawn76]

Here's my question: why would the Gorgon ride now, after thousands of years of not doing so? There are a great many theories as to why the Gorgon doesn't simply crush all of Cerilia (since he's, yaknow, an unstoppable monster with a huge sway of vassal-states) so if the Gorgon DID ride forth, I'd be interested in knowing what caused him to.

What I think might be more interesting is examining the advancement of the core states of Cerilia like Ghoere and Medeore.

If I were to advance my idea then he's waited the longest he can to allow the Anuireans to weaken themselves, how long since the Empire fell? 500 years? Now that their in disarray he can mop them up with ease. That said it's not essential unlike the invasion which is a plot device to introduce core 4E concepts.

To be honest I brain farted the idea out more as a quick example of the direction it could go!

Truthfully I started this thread to see what other ideas are out there. Personally I prefer your idea as a way to go, if we weren't speculating how Wotc are likely to do it . The problem with reintroducing a setting as I see it is that they feel some compulsion to advance the storyline and also retcon/grand occurence to allow for the 4E changes. It makes sense really, why rehash the same material thats available elsewhere.

[Aluman]

A more likely canidate for invasion style stuff is the Magian and Raven (an alliance between them, Raven getting Vosgard to rjuven, Maigan getting from Khansi to Anurie)

[Arawn76]

A more likely canidate for invasion style stuff is the Magian and Raven (an alliance between them, Raven getting Vosgard to rjuven, Maigan getting from Khansi to Anurie)

That's a fun idea. I'm probably going to steal that.

[night_druid]

Why invasion? Internal conflicts are much more common and can be as interesting, if not moreso. The king dies, leaving a weak-willed son to rule, the usurper murders his own brother to take the throne, a king lusts after another king's wife, a royal heir is revealed to be illigetimate due to the queen's affair with the king's favorite duke, etc.

[Arawn76]

Why invasion? Internal conflicts are much more common and can be as interesting, if not moreso. The king dies, leaving a weak-willed son to rule, the usurper murders his own brother to take the throne, a king lusts after another king's wife, a royal heir is revealed to be illigetimate due to the queen's affair with the king's favorite duke, etc.

I'll steal this as well .

[Big Mac]

Should Wotc release Birthright 4E , do you think they should advance the timline?

I know little about Birthright, but am against time jumps (as they kill or age NPCs for little to no benifit). What is wrong with discovering a new land (that just happens to be full of 4e races)?

You can't discover new lands for every setting, but other possibles could be:

• Dwarves dig down and break into a hollow world like region at the centre of Aebrynis and find the 4e races living just below Cerilia,
• Thaele is found to be frozen by an epic time freezing spell that is dispelled to reveal a long-lost land full of people frozen in time for thousands of years (and the 4e races).
• Some sort of magical disease *cough* Shadowrun *cough* spreads across the land, unlocking hidden bloodline abilities and transforming 10 percent of the population into races that have been "concealed inside the gene pool of other races". (i.e. some elves turn into eldarin, some humans - perhaps all from the same subrace - turn into tieflings, etc).
• Someone forges some sort of magical portal between Aebrynis and its moon (I'm assuming it has a moon) and creates an alliance with one of the factions on the moon, with the intention of creating an army (including 4e races) that can invade Cerilia.
• 4e race X is created as some sort of living weapon in an attempt to build an army that can overthrow a nearby country.

I'm sure that someone more familiar with Birthright could come up with other methods to introduce new races.

[agathokles]

Well, considering that Birthright's planet, Aebrynis, has not been explored beyond a single continent (Cerilia), there's indeed space for other races in the southern continent of Aduria or in the eastern continent beyond the Sea of Dragons.

GP

[combatmedic]

I agree- no timejumps and no blowing up the world. Develop instead the other continents and islands, as well as the underworld.

My suggestions:

The Tiefling empire of Bael Turath could have been an ancient civilization native to Southern Aduria, corrupted by the Powers of Darkness long ago. It might well predate the evil of Azrai. Or maybe its corruption was one of his first projects after he turned to evil. Placing it in the distant south of Aduria explains why tieflings didn't show up sooner- they live pretty far away. Individual tieflings would likely be mistaken for minor awnshegh, or else creatures of the Shadoworld.

Dragonborn should be from somplace far off, as well. The Dragon Isles are a possibility. I don't recall that they were ever detailed in canon. An alternative location would be Djapar. When dragonborn begin to explore Cerlilia, the Khinasi might recognize these creatures of legend.

Eladrin are a special case, as they are really just high elves/grey elves. Birthright already has its own distinctive elves. I don't see eladrin as a particulalry good fit.

[Big Mac]

My suggestions:

The Tiefling empire of Bael Turath could have been an ancient civilization native to Southern Aduria, corrupted by the Powers of Darkness long ago. It might well predate the evil of Azrai. Or maybe its corruption was one of his first projects after he turned to evil. Placing it in the distant south of Aduria explains why tieflings didn't show up sooner- they live pretty far away. Individual tieflings would likely be mistaken for minor awnshegh, or else creatures of the Shadoworld.

Sounds interesting. Makes me wish I knew more about Birthright, so that I could see how this fits in.

I don't suppose anyone knows of a Birthright wiki?

Dragonborn should be from somplace far off, as well. The Dragon Isles are a possibility. I don't recall that they were ever detailed in canon. An alternative location would be Djapar. When dragonborn begin to explore Cerlilia, the Khinasi might recognize these creatures of legend.

The name "Dragon Isles" sounds like it was made for Dragonborn.

Eladrin are a special case, as they are really just high elves/grey elves. Birthright already has its own distinctive elves. I don't see eladrin as a particulalry good fit.

Hmm. If you look at settings like Dragonlance, they dumped the standard D&D elf races (and added new elf races) so dumping eldarin for another setting would have a similar precident. If they don't fit in, they shouldn't be there.

[agathokles]

I don't suppose anyone knows of a Birthright wiki?

There's one at Birthright.net.

GP

[Big Mac]

I don't suppose anyone knows of a Birthright wiki?

There's one at Birthright.net.

Thanks. I just stumbled onto it myself. I don't think it was there last time I had a good look at Birthright.net.

I have to say that they are really seem to be putting in a lot of improvements over there. I hope that all the official sites (including Birthright.net) do well and (along with unofficial leading sites like Dragonlance Nexus, Canonfire!, Candlekeep and The Fraternity of Shadows) grab a lot of ENnie awards and proove* that the old settings still have legs.

* = I think that show, rather than tell, is the way to get new people to consider playing with these out of print game worlds.