[Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

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[Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby Big Mac » Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:04 am

The Rock of Bral has 30 councillors, in the Council of the City, each of whom is appointed to represent one of the barrios (or neighbourhoods) of The Rock. (There is also the Nobel Council and the Council of Captains.)

Has anyone seen any sort of information about one or more of these barrios?

Has anyone ever made a fanon map of them?

EDIT: I'll add a list of the known barrios:

BARRIOS OF BRAL:
  • The Burrows (SJR5 page 66) - Councilman not known
  • Dracon-town (SJR5 page 75) - Councilman Stakahlla
  • The Dwarven District (SJR5 page 65) - Councilman not known
  • The Elven Forest (SJR5 page 51) - Councilman not known
  • Gifftown (SJR5 page 66) - Councilman not known
  • Shou-Town (SJR5 page 73) - Councilman not known

LAST EDIT (by Big Mac 7 Nov 2017): Dracon-Town, Shou Town and The Elven Forest added to list of barrios. This leaves us with 24 unidentified barrios. There are 5 6 7 guild leaders (including three Underbarons) who have seats as Coucilmen in the Council of the City. That reduces the number of barrios required to 19 18 17. Additionally, we know that nobles are represented in the Council of the City, although we don't know how many noble Councilmen there are (yet).
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby GMWestermeyer » Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:58 pm

There is a map floating around, I think. I've done some minor development. one of the players in my Jammers game developed one, Kayanerenh Manito, a very small barrio in the low city where those from various 'Native American' style culture tend to congregate. Another of my players developed Gifftown, and I've done a little work on the Dwarven and Shou barrios.
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby Big Mac » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:14 am

GMWestermeyer wrote:There is a map floating around, I think. I've done some minor development. one of the players in my Jammers game developed one, Kayanerenh Manito, a very small barrio in the low city where those from various 'Native American' style culture tend to congregate. Another of my players developed Gifftown, and I've done a little work on the Dwarven and Shou barrios.


Do you think that barrios would only exist in the Low City, Paul?
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby GMWestermeyer » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:27 pm

Big Mac wrote:
GMWestermeyer wrote:There is a map floating around, I think. I've done some minor development. one of the players in my Jammers game developed one, Kayanerenh Manito, a very small barrio in the low city where those from various 'Native American' style culture tend to congregate. Another of my players developed Gifftown, and I've done a little work on the Dwarven and Shou barrios.


Do you think that barrios would only exist in the Low City, Paul?


Well, all of the official ones do. The Elven Forest is between the Middle & High Cities, but it isn't really a barrio.

I think the Low City is the natural place for them, sure... but both the Halfling and dwarven districts are almost Middle City, and are prosperous.

In any case, I'd keep the # of barrios down. The only one that isn't in the official books, but which makes sense to me, is a goblinoid barrio.
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby GMWestermeyer » Fri Oct 13, 2017 4:54 pm

Big Mac wrote:
EDIT: I'll add a list of the known barrios:

BARRIOS OF BRAL:
  • The Burrows (SJR5 pag 66) - Councilman not known
  • The Dwarven District (SJR5 page 65) - Councilman not known
  • Gifftown (SJR5 pag 66) - Councilman not known


Dracon-town (SJR5 pag 75) - Councilman Stakahlla

Shoutown (SJR5 pag 73) - Councilman not known

I did this chart long ago, it might be useful. (link to chart below) if anyone can figure out how to post images to this please feel free to post it here

It is not quite as complete as I would do it today. The Council of the City, for example, also has guild members, including the shipwrights, and merchant and noble representatives. The Council of the City is described on pages 9-10 & 70 of SJR5.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1798798116816787&set=gm.10155703109614449&type=3&theater&ifg=1
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby Big Mac » Tue Nov 07, 2017 9:59 pm

GMWestermeyer wrote:
Big Mac wrote:
EDIT: I'll add a list of the known barrios:

BARRIOS OF BRAL:
  • The Burrows (SJR5 pag 66) - Councilman not known
  • The Dwarven District (SJR5 page 65) - Councilman not known
  • Gifftown (SJR5 pag 66) - Councilman not known


Dracon-town (SJR5 pag 75) - Councilman Stakahlla

Shoutown (SJR5 pag 73) - Councilman not known


Thanks. I've edited those into the top post.

You mentioned four fanon write-ups of barrios in this post. Are any of those online? If not, would you be willing to let Wildspace: The Spelljammer Fanzine publish your two and ask your two players if they would be willing to have their ones published?

GMWestermeyer wrote:I did this chart long ago, it might be useful. (link to chart below) if anyone can figure out how to post images to this please feel free to post it here


Image

GMWestermeyer wrote:It is not quite as complete as I would do it today. The Council of the City, for example, also has guild members, including the shipwrights, and merchant and noble representatives. The Council of the City is described on pages 9-10 & 70 of SJR5.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1798798116816787&set=gm.10155703109614449&type=3&theater&ifg=1


I just noticed that myself.

The two different descriptions don't actually match up. :(

SJR5 Realmspace: Chapter Two: Life on the Rock of Bral, pages 9-10 wrote:Government
<snip>
The typical citizen makes his voice heard through the Council of the City, which is a body of 30 individuals appointed for life. These people are referred to as "Councilmen" and each represents a different neighbourhood or barrio of Bral. On occasion the membership changes to reflect the fluid population of the Rock. Surprisingly, each Underbaron sends a representative to the Council of the City.

In theory, the Council of the City advises the Prince on civic affairs and can, through a unanimous vote, overturn any royal decree. Unfortunately, the members of the council are all royal appointees and, oddly enough, Andru (or Frun or Cozar, for that matterr) has never been overruled by his civic leaders.
<snip>
The ruling prince routinely governs by royal decree making laws and decisions, and then appointing bodies to enforce them. For exampl, if a wave of street crime was to strike th city, Andru might order the penalty for a first offence raised from imprisonment to imprisonment plus the loss of a hand. The magistrates and their watches would then proceed to enforce it. Such a change may or may not be accompanied by the posting of notices and the hiring of criers to advice the general populace.

Theoretically, the Council of the City could overturn this decree by casting a unanimous vote against it. On the other hand, some members of the council are likely to have been robbed themselves. In any event, Prince Andru rarely appoints council members who might not support him.
<snip>


This first write-up gives us the following types of representatives:
  • Neighbourhood/bario representatives and
  • Underbaron representatives.

SJR5 Realmspace: Chapter Nine: The Low City, page 70 wrote:112. Council of the City

Housed in an old, but dignified building, the Council of the City is a relatively meaningless body that tends to rubber stamp the prince's edicts with little debate. Each major guild or race is represented, as well as territorial areas of the city. There are dwarven, elven and giff delegates as well as shipwright, merchant and noble representatives. Although the Council has the power to overturn the prince's laws, the current membership has been appointed, in it's entiriety, by Prince Andru or by Prince Frun, and the appointment is for life.
<snip>


This second write-up gives us the following types of representatives:
  • Guild representatives,
  • Race representatives (with dwarven, elven and giff reprentatives namechecked),
  • Territorial area representatives and
  • Shipwright, merchant and noble representatives.

Getting those two descriptions to fit together requires a bit of a "Ben Kenobi solution" that makes everything right (from a certain point-of-view).

Both mention representation by area.

The first description mentions Underbarons (while they are not mentioned in the second description). But if Underbarons control areas, they could be handwaved in that way.

The second description mentions guilds, races and gives shipwrights (surely a guild), merchants and noble representatives. Perhaps it would be possible to look at the territory that each controls to see how that would work.

I'll tackle noble representatives first. They already have their own government organisation: the Noble Council. That council consists of all the landowners in the city and there are 37 of them. That is a higher number than the entire number of Councilmen, so it's impossible for there to be a one-to-one representation of Nobles on the Council of the City. As it is impossible for that to happen, then I would argue that there would be a small fraction of nobles. Perhaps even a single noble who represents the entire nobility.

Let's have a look at guilds. The following organisations are referred to as "guilds" in Chapter Five: Guilds, Societies, and Orders:

GUILDS OF BRAL:
  • The Forgemen (SJR5 pages 76-77) - Councilman not known
  • Halfling Thieves' Guild (SJR5 page 34) - Councilman Underbaron Meredin Sandyfoot
  • The Honored Mages' Guild of Bral (SJR5 pages 35-36) - Councilman not known
  • The Juggler's Men (SJR5 page 35) - Councilman Underbaron The Juggler
  • Longshoremen's Guild (SJR5 pages 67-68) - Councilman not known
  • The Red Masks (SJR5 page 35) - said to be controlled by a Guldmaster who is not an Underbaron
  • The Shipwright's Guild (SJR5 page 34) - Councilman Irdana Shipwright
  • Shou Thieves' Guild (aka the Yakuza) (SJR5 page 34) - Councilman Underbaron Ozamata Ku Murawa

The Yakuza, Halfling Thieves Guild and the Juggler's Men are all run by Underbarons. This folds the mention of Underbarons in the first description into the description of guilds in the second description.

With the Red Masks being a new thieves guild, that is stealing territory from two other guilds, and their leader not being recognised as an Underbaron, I'd be inclined to rule them out from inclusion on the Council of the City and have the other thives guilds come in with the non-thieves guilds.

That would use up 5 slots on the council. Along with the 5 barrios we have identified (so far) that gives us 20 seats to fill (and as many of those as possible should really be associated with land).

I'm going to add The Elven Forest as a barrio, as it is defined as the "elven district". That increases the numbr of barrios to 6.

EDIT: I've found a hidden guild in the "100. Master of the Docks" description on pages 67-68 of SJR5 Rock of Bral. It's called the Longshoremen's Guild. It's based in the same building as the Harbormasters and the Royal Customs Officers.

EDIT2: I've found a second hidden guild in the "141 The Ironworks" description on pages 76-77 of SJR5 Rock of Bral. It's called the Forgemen. They are an ironworkers guild.
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Re: [Bralspace][Spiralspace] Barrios of Bral

Postby GMWestermeyer » Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:59 pm

Big Mac wrote:You mentioned four fanon write-ups of barrios in this post. Are any of those online? If not, would you be willing to let Wildspace: The Spelljammer Fanzine publish your two and ask your two players if they would be willing to have their ones published?


It is all online somewhere, I believe:

Kayanerenh Manito:
http://www.spelljammer.org/worlds/locs/RockOfBral/places/KayanerenhManito.html

The dwarf work is in this:
http://www.spelljammer.org/worlds/Bralspace/npcs/dwarves.html

Shou Town info is in the Rock of Bral entry to my SJ/OA guide here:
https://spelljammerblog.wordpress.com/2016/01/09/oriental-adventures-and-spelljammer-a-guide/

Giff is here:
http://www.spelljammer.org/npcs/groups/Giff_navy.html

I have a Giff write-up specific to Bral as well:

Gifftown

The Giff Naval House
The Giff Naval House is a large three building complex on Hammer Street, between Eel Street and Privateer’s Way, next to Krunz Kanonwerkz. This is one of the busiest and most important Giff Naval Houses in the known spheres. It’s large staff is overseen by Flag-Captain Greld Umbopu, a sly old warrior who has yet to succumb to the suicidal tendancies of most older giff. He gets on very well with Gifftown’s acknowledged leader, General Saerlg Tomojak, and is his chief advisor. He gets on less well with the other two most prominent giff on Bral, however, Post-Captain Wilhelmina and (Brevet) Sergeant-Major Tomogan Shaul Agamour. Agamour is something of a political rival, both see themselves replacing the General one day but the source of his tension with Wilhelmina is unknown. Some suspect they were once romantically involved.
The Naval House has all the required rooms, and a large firing range in its basement. Its library is extensive, and Umbopu sponsors monthly lectures on military tactics. Giff Navy members may take advantage of the House’s fine ‘Tea Room’ which serves those foods most favored by giff, or they may spend the night in one of the House’s large dormitory rooms, furnished with massive, comfortable beds.
The Naval House is staffed at all times, and operates an extensive courier service that sends packets to Shipwrecker and Ironpiece at least once a fortnight, and exchanges with Refuge every two to three months. The ‘tea room’ maintains complimentary copies of the ‘Crystal Ball’ for members to read if they choose, as well as a large announcements board in the lobby for those looking for work, or for employers looking for giff sailors.




Big Mac wrote:
GMWestermeyer wrote:It is not quite as complete as I would do it today. The Council of the City, for example, also has guild members, including the shipwrights, and merchant and noble representatives. The Council of the City is described on pages 9-10 & 70 of SJR5.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1798798116816787&set=gm.10155703109614449&type=3&theater&ifg=1


I just noticed that myself.

The two different descriptions don't actually match up. :(


Eh, I think the reconcile easily enough. Your work looks good, they are not contradictory, just focused on different parts of the council.

MODERATOR NOTE (by Big Mac): Discussion of smoke powder tax split into new Would Bral & similar asteroids impose Smoke Powder Air Tax? topic.
Last edited by GMWestermeyer on Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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