[Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

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[Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:27 pm

Atruaghin, 8 miles per hex by Thorf

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Click on the thumbnails to view these maps' pages in the Atlas of Mystara, where you can get the full resolution maps.

If you have any comments, corrections, or suggestions for things to add to the map, please post them here.

Sources: GAZ4 The Kingdom of Ierendi (1987), GAZ14 The Atruaghin Clans (1991), TM1 The Western Countries (1989). Also Wrath of the Immortals (1992), Champions of Mystara (1993), Karameikos: Kingdom of Adventure (1994).
Last edited by Thorf on Sat Jan 30, 2016 2:17 am, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Rewrote post completely.

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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:55 pm

Note that I have changed the filename for the updated map as follows:

atruaghin-8 --> atruaghin-clans-8

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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Andaire » Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:31 pm

Where is the Mystic Conveyor located? Is it at the Palace of Atruaghin?
Should it be marked on the map?
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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:18 pm

Andaire wrote:Where is the Mystic Conveyor located? Is it at the Palace of Atruaghin?
Should it be marked on the map?
Yep, it's located in the Palace of Atruaghin. I guess marking it on the map this way allows you to show players the map without having them ask questions you don't want to answer. I forget what the status of the Palace itself is, though - whether it's common knowledge, legend, or whatever.

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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Cthulhudrew » Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:34 am

IIRC, the Palace of Atruaghin is surrounded by some kind of zone of forgetfulness so that it's location remains hidden. You'd have to have some kind of Immortal influence or powerful magic to reach it. I'd have to double check the Gaz, though, to be certain.
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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:14 am

Cthulhudrew wrote:IIRC, the Palace of Atruaghin is surrounded by some kind of zone of forgetfulness so that it's location remains hidden. You'd have to have some kind of Immortal influence or powerful magic to reach it. I'd have to double check the Gaz, though, to be certain.
I think you're right. I seem to remember having a discussion about the fact that it's marked on the map long, long ago - perhaps on the old MML.

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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Andaire » Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:22 am

But sometimes information that should be kept out of the players' hands is shown on maps. For example if Haven or the Hutaakan Valley is shown on the map of Karameikos, this gives the players information they shouldn't have.
Heck, even having an accurate (or inaccurate!) map is something the PCs should not have! Only the Immortals could have such precise and truthful maps. It would require very wise sages and cartographers to get something even remotely close.
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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Havard » Mon Mar 09, 2009 2:59 pm

Andaire wrote:But sometimes information that should be kept out of the players' hands is shown on maps. For example if Haven or the Hutaakan Valley is shown on the map of Karameikos, this gives the players information they shouldn't have.
Heck, even having an accurate (or inaccurate!) map is something the PCs should not have! Only the Immortals could have such precise and truthful maps. It would require very wise sages and cartographers to get something even remotely close.
Is Haven really a secret?

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Re: Outer World: Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Marco Fossati » Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:10 pm

Havard wrote:
Is Haven really a secret?

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For most of the common Karameikan (including low level PCs) and for foreigners I think yes

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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Sat Jan 30, 2016 2:19 am

I posted the full updated map with surrounding countries at last. :)

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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Morfie » Sat Jan 30, 2016 3:19 am

Did you use UK English as a preference for the campfire names?
They are now Autumn, instead of Fall.

I am not complaining, as Autumn would be my preference as well :)

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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Thorf » Sat Jan 30, 2016 7:41 am

Morfie wrote:Did you use UK English as a preference for the campfire names?
They are now Autumn, instead of Fall.

I am not complaining, as Autumn would be my preference as well :)
Yes. All of my Mystara maps use British English throughout. :geek:

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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Hugin » Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:21 am

Thorf wrote:Yes. All of my Mystara maps use British English throughout. :geek:
Proper thing, I say!

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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Zendrolion » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:53 pm

Thorf wrote:If you have any comments, corrections, or suggestions for things to add to the map, please post them here.
I'm taking your word - after nine years! :P

Spurred by Thorf's recent post about Atruaghin on the FB page, I cast a more in-depth look at the updated map in regard to the original one. I've come up with some comments about the updated map, which I'm dropping below.

First, up the plateau. The updated map shows a plateau whose area is basically doubled. To fill this area up with something, Thorf expanded the grasslands, while leaving the size of the Elk Clan forest substantially untouched. This, in my opinion, generates some problems: (1) it changes the relative distances between the plateau clans, since the Elk Clan now is more distant from the Bear Clan; (2) it reduces the size of the Elk Clan territory in regard to the other plateau clans, since now the Elk Clan's land is smaller - coming from the original map - than the other two; (3) it extends the distance between the Elk Clan villages and the three battle sites down the plateau (Storms, Spirits, Fire Tears) - which supposedly and likely are battles against the Tiger Clan.

To overcome these problems, I propose to expand the forest and surrouding woods of the Elk Clan, about 5-6 hexes eastward and 1-2 hexes northward. Eastward, the woods's limit would end more or less one hex before the vertical line of hexes which includes the Battle of Storms. The distance of existing Elk Clan villages could be stretched on 1-2 hexes, in order to have Raccoon Tribe in line with the Battle of Storms, and the Deer Tribe (out of the woods, as in the original map) in line with the Battle of Spirits.
This would balance the territory of the three plateau clans, keeping their relative distances (and those between Elk and Tiger Clans) mostly as in the original map. Of course, the position of the three southern Elk villages (Owl, Beaver, and Raccoon) in relation to the two small spurs on the southern border of the plateau would be lost, but I consider this the lesser evil, since the original map is vastly wrong.

Then, down the plateau. The updated map has much more land between the Turtle and the Tiger Clans; however, the location of the Tiger Clan villages has stayed basically the same as in the original map, which has distanced too much the Tiger Clan villages from their counterparts in the Turtle lands. This, again, becomes inconsistent with the three battle sites on that border (Moon, Cowards, and Darkness).
Therefore I'd stretch a little the distance between the westernmost Tiger Clan tribes, in order to get a couple of them - and the three battle sites as well - as close as possible to the Turtle Clan border. On the Turtle side of the border, I'd stretch the distance between villages as well by 1-2 hexes in total, in order to have the Sea Lion Tribe on the border with the Tiger Clan.*

[* I see that in the slice of the new updated map posted on the Facebook page, Thorf has already put his hands on this issue, introducing a new Viper Tribe and adjusting the battle sites locations. I'd suggest moving one hex westward the Monkey Tribe, so as to have a distance between it and the other tribes more consistent with the ones of the original map.]

Another last thing I see on the northeastern border of the Clans is that the Darokinian trail going from Akesoli - besides, shouldn't the city be found on the lake coast? - to Fort Anselbury in a couple of hexes passes through Atruaghin lands, and in forested hill country. Is this making sense? I suppose the Republic created the trail, which is also an important military road connecting the Republic's heart with Akesoli via land, so why the trail passes through the Clans' lands and in rougher territory? Wouldn't it make more sense if the trail winded across the coastal plains, staying in Darokin-controlled lands?

As a last note, I found reference to some minor Atruaghin clans in canon modules. These are the Wolf, the Ferret, and the Boar Clans. Since there are several areas devoid of clans - the whole eastern half of the southern coast, the whole northern two-thirds of the Turtle lands, maybe even the hill country down the plateau around the Horse lands - could those minor clans be used to add some color to these regions (even only putting a simple label on the map, without villages)?
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Re: [Outer World] Atruaghin Clans, 8 miles per hex

Post by Cthulhudrew » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:53 pm

Zendrolion wrote:I suppose the Republic created the trail, which is also an important military road connecting the Republic's heart with Akesoli via land, so why the trail passes through the Clans' lands and in rougher territory? Wouldn't it make more sense if the trail winded across the coastal plains, staying in Darokin-controlled lands?
I'd imagine those borders with Atruaghin are more of a political understanding on the part of Darokin than they have anything to do with the clans (particularly given that, canonically, there don't actually appear to be any Atruaghin peoples living in or around the area, although I find this unlikely personally). That said, I think the trail would make more sense sticking primarily to the coast (save for where it branches off to the World Elevator); those straight lines cutting through wooded terrain don't make a lot of sense to me.

(In fact, I'd imagine the Borderland Magistrates along the northern border of Atruaghin have probably laid claim- legally or not- to much of that land.)

As a side note to this, I'd imagine this trail is the one referred to on the Trade Route map (p. 16 of the Gaz11 player's guide) that is referred to as being under construction as of 1000 AC; presumably that is why the Gaz14 map dropped it in when it wasn't present on the Gaz11 map. Note that the trail as shown in the Trade Route map is of rather different proportions as well (notably where the trail leads to "Atruaghin" directly from Ft. Anselbury, as opposed to south of Akesoli.

I would think that Akesoli is likely right on the coast as well. With a few exceptions, it seems to me that the official maps generally erred on the side of moving coastal communities back a hex or so from the coast, in order to preserve the shape of the coastline (which would otherwise be partially or completely hidden underneath the settlement icon). It's possible that Akesoli is a landbound city, with a separate port that is located several miles outside the main community, but this seems unlikely to me based on the descriptions given for the city.
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