Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

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Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sun Sep 18, 2011 1:04 pm

The map has finally been completed and can be found here:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq01AI_zUFRsajQ1Q0tBbVk/edit?ups=drive_web

I posted this map on the general topics forum initially, as I suspect that not everyone reads the geographical section on the Piazza. It is set at 1000AC.

Naturally, my thanks goes to all those who have worked on the various mapping tools that I used, as well as to all those whose maps I have used in part to compile this new updated map of the region. Unfortunately, the list of names is too long to give here (I have used as a reference point about 15 maps!).

Some points to note regarding the map are as follows:

1) Karawenn has been added into Norwold, just North of the Shire of Leeha.

2) I have added a suggested route for the Leehan trail which leads to Ghyr.

3) The trade routes going south from Kaarjala and North from Itamaa have been completed with a suggested final destination (which was not originally shown on the Fan Gazeteers of these regions)


4) I have included the dominions of any character who was in CMI (Test of the Warlords) onto the map, if their dominion appeared anywhere in this region in previous fan maps. I have also added the County of Lintaine, which is covered in detail here:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq01AI_zc2N1b1FBNFFVclU/edit?ups=drive_web

5) On the vaults of Pandius, the three Viasksoda tribes are described. I have set up a camp for each of these, using the locations described for where these tribes are usually found. The camp represents the location of their respective religious grounds where they gather during the summer solstice. During this period, 10,000-15,000 barbarians can be found at these locations. At other times of the year, this camp will usually number about 900.

6) There have been a number of differences in previous maps of this region, especially regarding which areas are forested North of the Great Bay, and where the mountains actually lay on the West of the map. I have tried to accommodate as much as possible, but have had to make some decisions about which maps take precedent over others. Hopefully, no one will take offence if parts of their maps have not been used here!

7) I have fleshed out parts of the map North of Kaarjala, as no maps I have seen went into much detail of this region. The new locations I have added will be detailed soon in a separate post.

8) I have included some villages (which do not normally appear on 24 mile hex maps) to ensure that some trade routes and dominion borders make more sense (ie to avoid trade routes ending abruptly at no settlement etc). However, it should be noted that not all villages in this region are shown on the map.

9) The hex tiles should generally be self explanatory. One which may need clarification however is the difference between the yellow and green grassland hexes. The yellow one represents grassland which is only average or less with regards to farming potential, while the green one represents grassland which would make excellent arable land. Clear hexes represent land which has already been converted into farmland (these usually are only present near large settlements), and these lands are generally civilized and safe to move around in.

10) One of the canon maps shows the Northern border of Norwold cutting through Kaarjala. Naturally, this map was designed before Kaarjala was placed in Norwold, so I have tweaked the borders in this region to exclude Kaarjala from the dominion of Norwold itself. This is because it is very unlikely that half of Kaarjala would be part of the dominion of Norwold and half would be outside of it! The Fan Gazeteer of this region also states that Kaarjala is not under King Ericall at the time this map represents.

Naturally, if anybody can spot something obvious that I have not included on the map, then please let me know and I will try to add it in.

Enjoy!
Last edited by Carillion on Sat Apr 06, 2013 6:11 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Hugin » Mon Sep 19, 2011 2:45 pm

Great job! I'll have to go over it and give it a closer look later.
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:07 pm

Again, very cool stuff.

Some things left out:

* Riftvale
* Graytor Castle
* Greenbriar (I would add a village symbol here marking the elven settlement in the woods).
* Rocheford (again, there is probably a village settlement within this region, south of Graywall.)

All of these are Karawenn-related and found on this map.

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:29 pm

A couple of other notes:
In addition to the Karawenn stuff, I invented the following names (I think):

Crystykk Forest
Diadem Woods
Firearch Valley
Skyskpire Volcano (From Karawenn novels)

They were not random inventions, but based on nearby locations.

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:28 pm

Hello Havard,

Having had another look, I'll add Riftvale (I overlooked that place in error), and will label Todstein Isle.

With regards to Greenbriar, Rocheford and Graytor Castle, I don't think there is enough room on that part of the map to label them all! I'll see what I can do, but I suspect Graytor Castle may have to be missed off.
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Tue Sep 20, 2011 9:02 pm

Whatever you decide will be fine. You have done a great job already. Thanks! :)

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Birchbeer » Thu Sep 29, 2011 5:24 pm

Do you have a source for the isle of Ghosts?
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:05 pm

Hello Birchbeer

There is a map of Brun on the Vaults of Pandius set in AC1160 (it was drawn by somebody called "Kal") which details that Island (all of it and not just the small part on my map). The place names are in Italian, and that Island is called "Isola degli Spettri", which I believe is Italian for "Isle of Ghosts", so that's where I got it from. I'm not sure if there is any source material for it as well.

I can't link to the map as I currently get hit by a malware program everytime I go on Pandius, and I'm not prepared to try at the moment as it messes up my PC. If you have a look though, I'm sure you'll find the map - I do remember it being saved in a place which was easy to find.


Regards,

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sun Jun 29, 2014 6:10 pm

This map has now been updated and can be found here:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq01AI_zdUx4d21wZDlBVjQ/edit

The map may appear slightly blurry for about 15 seconds before it loads up fully as it's quite a big file.


Regards,


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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Sun Jun 29, 2014 6:27 pm

Carillion wrote:This map has now been updated and can be found here:

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq01AI_zdUx4d21wZDlBVjQ/edit

The map may appear slightly blurry for about 15 seconds before it loads up fully as it's quite a big file.


I need permission to access this file....

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:54 pm

Oops! :oops:

The protected view setting is now turned off, so there shouldn't be any problems now.

Good spot Havard!
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:08 pm

Works now, thanks!

The map looks great man! I love how you have incorporated the information from the Karawenn files as well as the various GazFs. I also think the added Mystara logo was a nice touch. :)

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:45 pm

Havard - thanks for the positive feedback!

I finally worked out how to get the Mystara Logo into a GIMP file about four weeks ago - it's a lot easier than I first thought. I'm now revisiting my old maps and adding it in to all of them. I've now only got one more map to go!
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Sturm » Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:24 am

Great map, except for the added logo I think that's the same map that was published in your article about the area in Threshold issue 2, right? or there are other updates I didn't spot? In the latter case it should be pointed out to Shawn that this one would be the correct version of the map to upload on the Vaults..
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby stanles » Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:55 am

Sturm wrote:Great map, except for the added logo I think that's the same map that was published in your article about the area in Threshold issue 2, right? or there are other updates I didn't spot? In the latter case it should be pointed out to Shawn that this one would be the correct version of the map to upload on the Vaults..


Carillion sent it to me off list too, so it'll be going up at the next update ...
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Mon Jun 30, 2014 8:31 pm

Hello Sturm,

The map showing on this thread until recently, and the one that was uploaded onto Pandius wasn't the one published in Threshold 2. Instead, it was an earlier version, that wasn't very user friendly (no hex guide, no compass etc). It also had a few mistakes on it as well, so these are the issues I am trying to correct now.

The map published in Threshold issue 2 is very similar to the one I've just linked to, but that map was never uploaded onto Pandius (except as part of Threshold magazine issue 2 itself).
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Sturm » Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:30 am

Ok, understood, thanks!
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Sun Jan 15, 2017 8:27 pm

I've finally managed to get around to updating this map (my previous version was completed a number of years ago!) The updated version can be found here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq ... o2aFk/view

This map supersedes the map I did for my article that was published in Threshold issue 2, and should also be compatible with Thorf's recent mapping project (which is well worth a look if you haven't already done so!).

About 90% of my latest map agrees with Zendrolion's maps that were published in Threshold issue 7 (I've amalgamated most of the details of the two separate maps he did of this region). The main area where there are still noticeable differences involves Leeha and the surrounding regions, as JTR also published a map with a different take of the area at about the same time. As these maps were published in the same edition of Threshold, I'm assuming that neither of them knew what the other was publishing, and so couldn't tie them up accordingly). I've now tried to rectify this and have tied them up as best as I could. Threshold issue 7 can be found via the following link for those that are interested in viewing Zendrolion's and JTR's maps:

http://www.pandius.com/Threshold_7.pdf

Whilst I was working on the previous version of my map, I had missed a sketch of the Great Bay that was hidden away in one of the Poor Wizard's Almanacs. This sketch shows some interesting details such as trade shipping routes and the northern coastline of the Great Bay. I've therefore made some changes to my latest map to reflect this. Bruce Heard also published an excellent article back in 2012 about Brun's climate which has influenced my latest map. It also appears that Zendolion used these sources as well. Bruce's article can be found here:

http://bruce-heard.blogspot.co.uk/2012/ ... imate.html

The only disagreement I have with Bruce's climate map is that in my opinion, the Eastern coast of Norwold north that lies north of the Landsplit River would not be tundra until further north, due to the maritime winds which would make the coast slightly warmer. Here is a map of the real world's taiga (pine forest) area:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiga#/me ... _Taiga.png

As you can see from this illustration (the part which represents Western Canada, which is the real world equivalent of Norwold), taiga can grow further North on the eastern coast than the lands directly to the West, where the climate drops in temperature. This explains why I placed taiga on the coast near the village of Hemvaara, but not further inland. Incidentally, the Wikipedia map suggests that we could even put taiga on the Norzee coast at the southern end of the Bay of Tears (but not directly south of it), although I'm not proposing I actually do this.

It should also be noted that in Fan Gazetteer for Kaarjala (F10), it details an artifact called the Great Sampo, which creates warm air for Kaarjala itself. This would push back the arctic climate (which is denoted by blue in Bruce's article linked above) for this area as well.

The only other issue that needs a mention is Karawenn. This location is canon, as it is the subject of three novels by Douglas Niles. However this area was never placed anywhere specific, and so its location is up for debate. More can be read about Karawenn here:

http://pandius.com/karawenn.html

The most popular placement for Karawenn is just North of the Great Bay, although it doesn't appear on either JTR's map or those completed by Zendrolion. I've however drawn an alternate version of my latest map which changes the name of the Norwold province of Enderover to that of Karawenn, as well as adding some towns that appear in the relevant novels. I've also included the World's End Canyon which also appears in the novels. This map should be useful for those who wish Karawenn to be placed in Norwold, and can be viewed using the link below:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1WEBq ... RJSlU/view

If anyone has any comments, then please let me know!

Regards,

Matt.
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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Havard » Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:18 pm

Nice work!

Loved seeing the alternate Karawenn version alongside the main one :)

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Re: Outer World: Northern Norwold, 24 Miles per Hex

Postby Carillion » Mon Jan 16, 2017 8:49 pm

Hello Havard,

I was hoping you would stop by! I need to ask you a question as our resident Karawenn expert!

In short, I wanted to include all settlements in Karawenn which could be considered to be a small town (or larger), but as I have never read the Karawenn novels, I'm not sure which ones to include. Also it appears from your timeline that some settlements on your map of Karawenn may not have existed during 1000AC (but instead appeared afterwards), which adds a further level of complexity.

Therefore my question would be this - which settlements of small town size (or larger) existed in 1000AC in Karawenn? These are the settlements that I would like to include in the second version of my map, but at present, I've had to guess!

Any help would be appreciated.

Regards,

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