Robin wrote:Though I see it more Threedimensional; A spheroid Prime Plane with the four spheroid elemental planes arranged like the 4 points of a D4 around it
and then Limbo twirled in between (as it is a moebious ring Plane ), thus enabling it to touch/affect alle 5 prime Planes, continously.
And then all together continuously moving with the seasons
In my opinion it is impossible to realistically depict these planes on a two dimensional map. So your model is as good as mine. I thought about other reprentations, but I rather like this more classic version. I took some inspiration from Frank Mentzer's illustrations in the Gold Box for this. It would probably be better to label this as a diagram than a map though
I totally agree that is nigh impossible...but I have contact with some artists from the kunstacademie (art-academie) here in town and they intend to give it a try in a "gif" moving picture file...so when they succeed I absolutely will deliver this here.. I myself am trying something similar with several balls, and such, so either way something will come up.
I had missed that post, thanks for linking to it
That is an interesting take on it. On the other hand it would make the Spirits and Ethengar rather dark though. Officially, the Ethengar gaz keeps the whole concept rather vague. I originally thought it could be another name for the Dreamlands or even all of the planes. The way I see it, Limbo is much too closely tied with the souls of the dead, Entropy and Undeath though, while many of Ethengars spirits do not give me that vibe. This is why I would make most of them native to the Ethereal itself. In any case, these decisions should not affect the actual map too much.
I agree it would make it dark indeed. But not necessarily, as Bruce refferred in his story that deeper within this realm the dark was more available, with its undead soul hunters. I think as Bruce suggested that the nearer to the Prime Plane (ie. where it touched in Ethengar) it is much lighter, safer and more peaceful. Keep in mind that when a character dies, it arrives at a random location in Limbo.
The Realm of the Dead (an Outer Plane from M3 indeed), I think more as one of the After life plains where you go (as Bruce mentioned) after a period of time in Limbo.
Robin wrote:Dreamlands I believe to remember (Immortals Guide Wrath) was another Dimension, and not even a Plane and as such should not be mapped within this map. It has its dimensional contacts all over the Inner Planes though, as thus I would place Dreamland Gates on each to reflect that.
Could you be confusing this with the Dimension of Myths, or the Dimension of Nightmares perhaps? AFAIK, PC1 is the only book to reference the Dreamlands. This is the plane of the Fey and home to the Court of Oberon. It is not unlike the Feywild of the 4E/E cosmology, though I'm thinking it should have fewer Dinosaurs. I am going to make a separate post about M3 Twilight Calling, but I am also leaning towards making the Dreamlands the same plane as the Green Realm from that module.
Hmmm the Fewwild.. (though I personally think 3rd and further editions of D&D corrupted the cosmic structure of D&D and even AD&D2 which deemed much more logical than the later editions
), I agree it could be similar, but indeed much different...without the dino's indeed. Eitherway. I do not see it as a Sopheroid Plane, but more as a thick strechted Glob, crawling chaotically between the elemental and prime, toching it at chaotic (as it is) intervalls).
From the Rules Encyclopedia;
Robin wrote:To the other Locations; The Maze is actually an Outer Plane, not an Inner Planar Location.
Yes, you are right. I didnt think to consult the spell description last night, but it does specifically say that it leads to somewhere on the Astral Plane.
From AD&D2 PHB;
This spell creates an indestructible maze in the Astral Plane and places one victim into the maze (he gets no saving throw). The intelligence of the victim determines the time he needs to escape the maze.
An extradimensional space is brought into being upon the utterance of a maze spell. The subject vanishes into the shifting labyrinth of force planes for a period of time that is dependent upon its Intelligence. (Note: Minotaurs are not affected by this spell.)
Both seem to suggest a temporary creation. Although in Planescape a Maze Plane is referred to where the spell leads (http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/cre ... 0407163435
Robin wrote:Just as the Bag of Holding, Shelter and House of Zebulon locations many of these exist only if the corresponding magi item exists.
That is an interesting philosophical question. Does that mean that mortal wizards are actually able to create new planes? Or do they reach out to a planar location and create the connection between that and the item?Of course the House of Zebulon seems to be a unique item.
I totally agree. But think of it like the Bag of devouring which is a transdimensional mouth of a creature elsewhere (read Dragon Ecology of a Bag of Devouring(sorry forgot the edition). Maybe they only copied the magic they encountered before, with this creature.
As thus the small outer planes they create are small, and temporarily (some thing must be within it, it can't be subjected to Anti/dispel magic, nor can it be placed into other interplanar/interdimensional items/gates/vortives and such or will destroy both.
I believe to remember that Bruce spoke of 4 or 5 houses, and I seem to remember a Tower of Zebulon , making it more than 1