Great School of Magic /Glantri City

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Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Robin » Mon Feb 27, 2017 10:24 pm

While delving through my old stuf as in that post with the same name....I retrieved an old isometric picture of the Great School of Magic in Glantri.
While examaning it to redraw (it is way too damaged by mouse urine and nibbling to reveal)...I studied th scale I used and the scale used in the Gaz 3 and GKoM maps.
Some things I noted;
First the City map on the back of the Glantri national map has NO scale at all.Neither in Gaz 3 nor GKoM.
Secondly the scale which was used to determine the size of the Great School of Magic (1 inch = 20'). This would give a very small school, even todays smaller universities have much vaster areas, so I thought while making the Isometric map that something must be wrong.
Examining the Western side of the GSM which is 4 inch thus according the scale 80'
Refferring that to the City of Glantri map, where the same side is measured 60 mm (using the metric system which is more detailed).
as such 60 mm would be 80' and thus 6 mm would be 8'.
checking that size to buildings, structures and vessels on the map which all seem to be in the same scale. I see many, many areas where there is aple space to turn one's ass...let alone function in it.
mini godolas 0.8 mm width =less than 1.5 feet width??, Small Galley 2 mm width gives a small galley of 2.6 feet wide also very small and unusable for transport, letvalone the crew needed. referring this back to normal sizes The scales should at least be doubled to be functional.
The same is with several structures; NW several buildings are 6 mm wide or even less or have sections of this width or less. if we use a double scale it seems to be fitting.
The same with the referential isometric picture of three buildings on Circus pool. these reveal how the building is constructed and thus explains some usage. especially the tables and chairs of less than 40cm in size deemed flawed, but even the size of the buildinfgs themselves. Look also at the ropebridges on the 3 red towers SE, these would be only 3 to 4 feet wide. Just as all the roof windows (the small triangulas on top) .
all in all I can only assume the scale on the GSM map inside the Gaz 3 cover was flawed. and instead 20' it should be 40' minimum.
I would even dare to go to change feet into yards thus making 1 inch 20 yards=60 feet....but this might be too brazen

1 inch is 25.4 mm btw

All in all the scale is wrong and even according the text the city should be larger in size not counting the suburbs.
So I dare to ask...what size is best according to you all....
1 :( ....GSM map 1 inch = 20' thus city map 60 mm =80'
Or as I suggested
2 ;) ....GSM map 1 inch = 40' thus city map 60 mm =160'
Or even my brazen idea
3 :twisted: ....GSM map 1 inch = 20 yards=60' thus city map 60 mm =240'


Eitherway I restore the Isometric map, in its readjusted scale with an Venetian building style as explained in the text. And I soon will reveal it here :o :o :ugeek: :lol:


One thing though must be from my heart....
How nice the Glantri city map is, and how the artist tried to mimic Venice..he failed....Probably he never has been there or has no sense of referring sizes in reality to maps.
For example real Venice canals are smallllll , and in Venice most buildings can always be reached WITHOUT using gondolas by small alleys in the middle (Check google maps and switch between the sattelite and the map) as thus there are many, many small bridges.. and creepy dark alleys..
Neither the alleys nor the bridges are be seen in the Glantri map, and the canals are thus wide a gondola can turn whereever.(something impossible in many Venice canals. I would embrace much more of these as it give Glantri more the feel the text describes...A pity the artist did not.
Ok ..I assume he interpretet with artistic freedom, yet even in a city logic prevails differently.
First Venice is like Glantri a mediaval city where the streets (and thus also canals) are small in width, to prevent loss of warmth, rain etc (that the reason those european old buildings ALL have a wider top than bottom), Secondly, even magic users do not like to use their magic for everything... they are limited in the use of their memorized spells, thus would more logically be ued to work with walking or gondola in Glantri.


Then one last final remark.
In the GKoM adventure Test of Darkness there is a picture labelled Great School of magic in the beginning. This is just wring; not only is it English architecture of the late 1800th and it has a green tree haze in the background, is just a plain series of structures, but mostly it does NOT, ABSOLUTELY NOT refer to something the glantrians could have made, nor does it semblance the GSM map.
More logically is that this picture does NOT, completely NOT belong here is is used wrongly...I is bettr used as an outhouse elsewhere in Glantri or a other school like area...as gloomy as it is i think better in the darker north . ..

Just some thoughts. :geek: :o :shock:
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby micky » Tue Feb 28, 2017 2:29 am

as a point of comparison here is a map that does have a scale likely using the Gaz3 GSoM (1 inch=20 ft) given scale as more of an overall reference

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/magnification01/m_glantricity_zpshm4reqhz.gif

I do agree.. I did some scale work on my first attempt to fully map out Glantri City (ie the main city and suburbs) but that was years ago. I don't remember what I decided to go with but I think 1 inch to 40 ft might be a better choice.

and one last parting shot..

remember... it isn't called Glantri:Kingdom of Magic :lol: for nothing.. :P
Remember... two words.. Gerrid Rientha

take nothing in it as gospel. I did not. It had cool art work, that is about it. Much of it made as much sense as the great crater :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Robin » Sun Mar 12, 2017 9:50 pm

i checked, measured and checked again.
the gsm map i have is isometric, and on a 40'scale...this seems best...
i'll post the old map and the newer maps soon...worrking on it.

finally we'll be able to envision the GSM in a sort of 3d...

and the fun part is...a clever 3d artist...might be able to use the isometric maps then to create a 3d model...
at least i 'm gonna give this a try somewhere in this year.
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Robin » Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:34 pm

I've found this in an article of Bruce Heard (Dragon magazine 161 page 101)
Question Reader;
The scale used in the city map of GAZ3 The Principalities of Glantri does not make sense. For example, the City Library ends up measuring 15-20’ in diameter. Is this correct?

Answer Bruce Heard;
No. Here’s a better set of scales:
City map: 1” = 80 yards
Inside cover maps: 1” = 50 yards
Geographical map: 1 hex = 8 miles
This should bring the overall length of the Great School of Magic up to 900’ and the diameter of the library tower to 120’— not huge by any standards, but now you may breathe normally without fear of causing entire bookshelves to fall over Note that the boats on the canal were added essentially for illustration purposes—their scale is a bit off to keep from reducing the larger ships to mere spots on the canals.


This means that 1 inch on the cover map is 50 yards and NOT 20'. as far as i know a yard is 3 feet, so each inch must be 150'!!
much larger than I suggested, and made my initial map on. As I did my map isometric in a doubled scale of 40' instead of 20'.

However much I honor Bruce words, the 50 yards deems still flawed. as some city aspects (walls etc) become ridiculously large. The curtain wall of the GSM was according the inner cover 2.5-3', in my scale 5-7', in Bruce's scale 12-13 yards(36-39 feet) ridiculously wide for an inner city building...the outer city walls as being 4 GSM walls wide, would become even 48-52 yards(144-36 feet).

As thus I think Bruce meant feet instead of yards, thus making the GSM 200' wide instead the 80' the map initially suggested, somewhat larger than the 160' I suggested,
but not thus overly large as Bruce suggested in the quote above...600' , 200 'wide with an average curtain wall of 14-17 feet wide.

The inner map the GSM is 4 inches (10cm), on the outer map the same area is 2.36 inch(6cm) as both must be equal to 200'...thus making the City map scale 1 inch =84,75 feet...or 1 cm =33,33 feet
this makes the GSM curtain walls a real feasible scale and the curtain walls also (9mm=30')


I have to readjust the scale I used thus far a tiny bit, but the Isometric map is as thus far restored, another from the opposite direction is in the making, as architectural correct interior maps (taking in weight distribution of upper constructions through foundation etc).
All will be available soon.
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Baron » Sun Mar 26, 2017 5:31 pm

I can't wait! (OK, hyperbole.) But I'm dreaming up how to introduce my current players to Glantri (pre-WOTI), and haven't prepared anything yet. Wish I could find a really good floorplan for the whole Great School, which I would expect to go underground or something.
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Robin » Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:23 am

thanx...I do my best to speed things up.
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Re: Great School of Magic /Glantri City

Postby Hausman » Mon Mar 27, 2017 5:47 pm

Hi.

Here is another reference of measure to the GSM.... page 60 of Wrath of the Immortals (book 2)

https://i.imgsafe.org/9401931a2a.png

I hope it helps, Robin = )

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