Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

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Arrius Nideal
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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:07 am

In the google drive folder is also an online editable character sheet (PDF). Have fun!

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:42 am

Version 2.5 has been released and sent to the art developer to make into PDFs. It might take a week or two to finish, but I'll provide an update if it takes more.
I'll also release a change log once they are ready.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Gildean » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:21 pm

Warcraft 5e it's fantastic, you're doing a really good job : )

The first session was behind me, the trouble at Elvyn Forest, it fell out very neatly. The only thing I would change is the mana system, write the mana cost for each spell separately.

What are the plans for 2018? Will we see more content? I am happy to see a classic dungeon spread or maybe even a campaign created for this system. One for the horde the other for the alliance : )

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:22 am

Gildean wrote:
Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:21 pm
Warcraft 5e it's fantastic, you're doing a really good job : )

The first session was behind me, the trouble at Elvyn Forest, it fell out very neatly. The only thing I would change is the mana system, write the mana cost for each spell separately.

What are the plans for 2018? Will we see more content? I am happy to see a classic dungeon spread or maybe even a campaign created for this system. One for the horde the other for the alliance : )
It's great that you're enjoying it.
@Mana: Some spells have different mana costs than normal, such as strike and sigil spells--they cost half the mana cost of other spells of the same level.
The main reason spell costs scale with spell level and proficiency bonus is to allow higher-level casters to cast much cheaper lower-level spells while keeping the general amount of higher level spells down. This discourages going "Nova" (tossing your highest-level spells once each round) and encourages a combat stages mentality, as well as maximizing the benefit of spells in conjunction with allies' abilities.

As for 2018: After 2.5 is published, I intend to have 2.6 add world-affecting content from previous editions.
1. Mass Combat: By adding rules for masses of soldiers and army command, we can have something of Warcraft III in our tabletop 5e games. The rules will be integrated and character-based, allowing individual heroes to fight on the field against armies (although the numbers are against rash heroics unless you're high enough level).
2. Strongholds: By adding costs and benefits for strongholds, we can have something like the Warlords of Draenor's garrison rules. This also supplants mass combat, and is a good money sink for adventurers. By giving settlements a stronger framework, we can also have more world-based rules.
3. Business rules: Alchemists and tinkers may opt to start businesses to fuel their discoveries and crafting-based class features. With these rules, crafters (indeed, characters of all types) can have more consistent cash flow.

We're also hoping to get the monster manual updated to the latest edition.

Edit: When it comes to campaigns and content--there are also plans for Ragefire Chasm to be added as a module, along with Deadmines.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Zeromaru X » Sun Apr 01, 2018 9:51 pm

Will you have into account the lore revelations in Chronicle 3?


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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Zeromaru X » Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:10 am

Yes. First, there seems to be some inconsistencies between this book and the other two (wasn't someone proofreading it?). If you don't mind spoilers, and beyond the inconsistencies, it seems that the Old Gods are behind the wars that followed the Third (so, the plot of WoW). And also, some dungeons/raids have canon champions that cleared them (champion=WoW player—yeah, players are canon now). The Horde did more dungeons/raids, but the Alliance dealt with the more troublesome.

The gamepedia article has a comprehensive list of the stuff.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:09 am

Hmm...I've seen worse retcons (at least in terms of characters) in existing novels (like Arthas: Rise of the Lich King, which made Arthas indecisive and soft-spined--total 180 from him).
The conversion project will try to be up to date with World of Warcraft's latest expansion in the core rules, but the base timeline for games is Vanilla World of Warcraft (though it references expansions, such as TBC and WotLK). It's suggested that events in expansions are all possible realities in your head-canon.
Of course, any modules that involve expansion timelines assume the canon events happened (if we ever get to make the Hellfire Citadel raid), though DMs are surely encouraged to weave these modules into existing storylines rather than rigidly sticking to canon (which may or may not be relevant to their games).

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Zeromaru X » Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:48 am

Talking about the Lich King, they retconned him again. Now, Arthas always coexisted alongside Ner'zhul. But Arthas overpowered him and trapped the orc in his guilt over the fact that he was the one responsible for the corruption of the orc race.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Zeromaru X » Wed Apr 04, 2018 1:50 am

Talking about the Lich King, they retconned him again. Now, Arthas always coexisted alongside Ner'zhul. But Arthas overpowered him and trapped the orc in his guilt over the fact that he was the one responsible for the corruption of the orc race.
Arrius Nideal wrote:
Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:09 am
The conversion project will try to be up to date with World of Warcraft's latest expansion in the core rules, but the base timeline for games is Vanilla World of Warcraft
Interesting. So, your conversion is more like the D20 books in the timeline?

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Wed Apr 04, 2018 6:51 am

There's the funny thing, actually. In the novel I've mentioned by Christie Golden, Arthas utterly destroyed Ner'zhul. Lich King in WotLK was just Arthas (sans Ner'zhul).
It seemed they retconned the retcon.

Personally, I've preferred the Warcraft III version where they unite into one unholy abomination. There's a certain dramatic element in knowing the worst of the Horde (an ex-shaman) and the worst of the Alliance (ex-paladin) teamed together and nearly conquered the world.

@Timeline: That's the core assumption, yes. In a way, our project here is a spiritual successor to the original White Wolf books.

Edit: I haven't answered the original point. Yes, we intend to canonize content in Chronicles.
Version 2.6 will involve a heavy restructuring in format and organization to be in line with the Player's Handbook in terms of chapter order and content, and the last few chapters in the document will be focused on cosmology. The Light-Void, Order-Disorder, Life-Death duality and Elemental role in the cosmos will be mentioned.

Overall, the approach will be a conciliatory one: we'll try to be ambiguous over retcons and changes that prove unpopular, and retain original cases where obvious retcons exist.
For example in the former case, we will use the Lich King's proper title instead of Arthas or Ner'zhul, and not mention any dispute after merging with the Lich King (staying silent on Ner'zhul's fate between his death in the novel and his browbeating in Chronicles 3). For the latter, such as the Forsaken being healed by the Light (with the healing feeling painful instead of being destructive), it's kept the same way--any physical restoration of wounds is offset by the disintegration the undead suffers (so instead of being 'healed' and then taking double damage, they take normal damage instead).

Not the most graceful solution, but it was not a graceful retcon. :P

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by kachimbo » Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:47 am

Hi! I'm really thankful for your work in this conversion. I have been running a game with my friends (two different groups) for about three sessions now and we're really enjoying it.

But We still have some doubts about the game!

1- A warrior can maintain concentration on a shout and a spell at the same time, like the paladin and Dk (aura)?

2- When a windwalker monk uses his Superior Martial Arts feature, he can deal the damage of his Martial Arts feature and Flurry of Blows ability as an Area Effect too, or only the damage of his two attacks with the attack action?

3- When a combat rogue uses his Revealing Strike on a armored enemy, the enemy’s AC is reduced to 0, or to 10 + Agi modifier?

4- Revealing Strike can be used to nullify natural armor bonuses?

5- Considering that you're going to release the new mana system soon, can you tell us about the future changes? Especially if the half caster classes (like the paladin) will still have the same pool of mana as a full caster class has.

6- When is that new edition coming? We are very anxious to see it!

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:33 am

Welcome, Kachimbo

1. Yes. It's fine to treat shouts as aura effects (bonus action to activate, may get lost if hit, have a 15 foot radius, and can use with other concentration effects). The wording will be clarified accordingly.

2. The monk can use any attacks that he can spend with the same action to use superior martial arts. After using superior martial arts, however, you can use Flurry of Blows (as SMA counts as an unarmed strike).

3. You can choose one source of a bonus to AC and nullify it. If you're targeting armor, treat it as 10 + Agi modifier.
For example, a rogue with 16 Agi wearing hide armor has an AC of 15 (12 + Agi). If you choose to remove the armor bonus, you target AC 13. If you remove the Agility bonus (which is better), you target AC 12.

4. Yes. Natural armor bonuses are treated as normal armor bonuses, so target AC 10 + Agi whenever you use Revealing Strike.

5. The change is mostly organizational, but certain spells cost half the mana cost for other spells of the same level. All strike spells (such as the shamans' elemental tongue or the druid's swipe and shred), sigil spells (curse of agony, immolate), and repeat-casting the same spell the round after casting the first all cost half mana. This does not stack, though.
As for half-casters--they have the same mana pool. Half casters' staggered access to spellcasting does not retard their mana pool increase, although only full casters have access to an invocation-type ability.

6. The newest edition is 2.5, which has been finished last month. The developer of the PDF is halfway done with it, and will hopefully be rolled out within two to three weeks.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by kachimbo » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:07 am

Thanks man, we really appreciate your support! Brought some more doubts from last session.

1- How many times an Enhancement Shaman can use his Channel Elements (Elemental Strike) per short rest? This feature was designed to be used at will?

2 – Can you tell us about the activation DC of technological devices? We still haven't seen it.

3 - After use the superior martial arts ability, the damage of Flurry of Blows attacks is dealt as an area effect too? Some players still have doubts about that.

In advance, thanks for the help!

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Thu Apr 26, 2018 6:31 am

No problem, man,

1. The Elemental Strike is a way to channel elements, and uses the channel elements resource (which is on short or long rest).

2. The activation check on technological devices was gradually phased out of the rules since its initial introduction (being a needless restriction), but holdovers remain. Ignore any text that mentions anything of an engineering check to activate--we'll revise the rules to eliminate residual terms.
A check still needs to be made for the malfunction check (which is a straight d20 roll).

3. Flurry of Blows after superior martial arts is treated as a normal flurry of blows (direct attack, not area of effect).

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Swampfox36 » Sun May 20, 2018 8:08 pm

Hello all,

First I'd like to say great job by everyone involved in the project! Truly great stuff.
I do have a question about some of the saving throws with Deathknights, Druids, Paladins, Shamans having both Stamina (Con) and Spirit (Wis). In 5e most classes are given one of the 3 big saves between Dex, Sta, Wis and one of the lesser saves between Str, Int, Cha. I understand from a flavor standpoint it would make sense for these four classes to have Sta and Wis (Spirit) for saving throws, but in the gameplay of 5e it is too strong from a saving throw standpoint for them to have 2 of the biggest 3 saving throws. Created classes and homebrews are balanced this way to prevent a class from becoming a saving throw monster in comparison to other classes. I was thinking something like this for changing them to balance with the other classes:
Deathknight: Stamina, Cha/Str
Druid: Spirit, Int ( like in the 5e PHB)
Paladin: Stamina, Cha/Str to mirror DK? or Wis and Cha like in 5e PHB
Shaman: Spirit, Int to mirror druid?

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Tue May 22, 2018 7:45 am

Hi, Swampfox!

You make a valid point on saving throws. It is possible that we will address this, although it is not currently in the team's priority list.

Cheers

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Tue May 22, 2018 9:23 pm

2.5 (May 22, 2018) Full changelog:
Intro
Clarified resurrection in lore, added conditions to simplify cold magic’s speed reductions, added scorched and chilled conditions, and clarified an ambiguity in 5e regarding choking (making garrotes and choking someone to unconsciousness possible mechanically).
Races
Rebalanced (mostly by nerfing) racial talents and reconsolidating others (Stoneform split into permanent natural armor and a 1/long rest ability, arcane legacy, rage/berzerking, and war stomp) into others.
Rebalanced all races using the Detect Balance homebrew tool, boosting most (gnome, draenei, goblins, orcs, pandaren) and nerfing a few (night elves can no longer hide as a bonus action, worgen form lost some powers)
Classes
Added the Alchemist Class (repurposed Apothecary subclass, rolled the Apothecary subclass and made two others: mutant and transmutor)
Added class talents (warriors can now rage, turned shout into a talent, including many others (hunter, rogue, and warrior, simplified fan of knives and other rogue talents), most are interchangeable, allowing a hunter to take the warrior’s heroic throw, a rogue to take the hunter’s umbral sight, and the warrior to take the rogue’s misdirection to simulate troll headhunters, forsaken deathstalkers/lightslayers, and high elven blademasters, respectively, as well as to provide for most racial archetypes without making them actual archetypes, but chosen abilities.
Added Two Weapon Fighting style for Death Knights, modified Hunter’s/Warlock’s bonded companion, incorporated several conceptual changes from Unearthed Arcana’s Ranger class into the Hunter, modified Frost Mages for more parallel with Fire Mages, clarified Paladin Seals and Crusader Strike, and Moon Priesthood powers, added Tinker Notebook
Removed Lightslayers and folded powers into hunter and rogue talents.
Cleaned up all spell lists and unified their format.
Monk lost Brewer ability.
Skills and Tools
Added CP and alternate crafting (via crafting points) rules, added malfunctioned condition for devices, fixed existing skills to accommodate
Clarified Touch-Blast Strike and explosive fuses
Clarified and simplified gathering materials from creatures (harvesting) and objects (scavenging).
Clarified the cost of consumables under the Item Creation Table
Feats
Brew Mastery feat introduced, which is the Monk Brewer ability, now turned into a feat instead to simplify the monk and augment their versatility should they choose to take it. It still requires Ki, and is one of the more class-oriented feats.
Magic and Spells
Cantrip number now tied to 1st level spells prepared.
Added new spells for Alchemist (Bomb, Mutation, Shift Skill), altered existing spells (frost/fire armor rolled into Elemental Armor and granted for Shamans, Entangling Roots added to Alchemist, brilliance aura lowered to level 4, Aerial Shackles, Telekinesis, and Death Grip rolled into a low level Telekinesis 3, DKN, MGE, and WRK, unshackled Charm and Dominate spells from being Person-Monster, and made them specific to creatures the class can bind, renamed Conjure/Charm/Hold/Dominate/Bind Creature to Conjure/Charm/Hold/Dominate/Bind only, and cut extraneous verbiage)
Overhauled Invigorate/Debilitate (HoT/DoT) into Sigil spells (Ancestral Guardian, Banshee's Curse, Carrion Swarm, Curse of Agony, Demonic Doom, Earth Shield, Holy Fire, Immolate, Inferno Blast, Lava Blast, Living Bomb, Mind Blast, Mind Flay, Moonfire, Parasite, Rejuvenation, Renewing Light, Riptide, and Shadow Strike).
Removed Lightning Shield (rolled into elemental armor), Swiftmend (rolled side powers to Rejuvenation), Nature's Seed (no clear role in overhaul), and Water Shield (allowed Shamans to cast Blessing of Wisdom), cleaned up death pact and lightning bolt (made chain lightning a shaman name), Mind Blast/Flay are Cha saves instead of Spi, changed Soul Fire to be a Warlock version of Pyroblast (due to closeness)
Also nerfed Death and Decay, and unified spell format.
Equipment
Added magic weapons (Mana Blade, Aetish, Frostmourne/Shadowmourne), and based items on rarity rather than price
Added Chapter 8: Classes in Warcraft, which provide suggestions on how to make character choices that go along with the presentation in the Warcraft universe.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by DarthManu » Wed May 30, 2018 6:06 am

Hi, I'm running a game and we are about to start our third session, and we have some doubts

lvl1 Hunter Talent (Natural Explorer): Does it mean the hunter has to pick Natural explorer, or it means he gets Natural explorer AND another talent that he can choose?

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Wed May 30, 2018 7:46 am

It means neither, in fact.
You can choose one talent you wish, but if you choose the talents between the parentheses, you end with the original PHB Ranger.
To avoid confusion, it was removed from the working version after 2.5.

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Re: Warcraft RPG 5th Edition...

Post by Arrius Nideal » Wed May 30, 2018 12:15 pm

Update and Hotfix:
The World of Warcraft 5e RPG Core Document has been updated to 2.5 to serve until the PDF is ready
A hotfix has been added (to make it version 2.5.1), which solved some typos and added a previously-considered table: the mana cost of spells by level. Players can refer to this table to avoid having to calculate mana costs individually for each spell, making the system more accessible.

If the PDF format is too problematic or proves to take too long to update, we will phase them out and return to relying on the Word document.

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