Moderator: Seer of Yhog
Chimpman wrote:Solution 3: The Kogolor dwarves were native to Brun. This is also possible, and not something that I'd thought of before these discussions. I'd have them live in the mountains of Rockhome, while their brethren immigrate into the Northern Reaches and Bridge of Oost regions. Having the Kogolor be in Brun first, might be the reason that the Skotharian dwarves venture here in the first place. Their homeland had just been devastated, and they had distant relatives in Brun whom they could turn to for succor. So far, this option causes the least amount of problems. The Kogolor and the SL gnomes have very similar mindsets. They could have been on Brun for a long time (pre Blackmoor even) and that could account for the different language and alphabet. It could also account for different immortals (my Skotharian dwarves have a very Blackmoor influenced pantheon), and possibly the reason that Kagyar ignores them - he has no followers among them. Perhaps he feels sorry enough for them to drop them off in the HW (thus protecting them from any radiance danger in the area), but not obligated to modify them and include them with his "chosen" people.
Havard wrote:I like this sollution too. It also makes Kagyar come off as less fascist than in Aallston's version, which is a good thing IMO. There have been goat herding dwarves on Brun since before Blackmoor so the Kogolor could be descendants of these. In the Shimmering Lands setting Rockhome is probably where most Kogolor are found, though I see them originally living further north in Norwold. They may have been driven from these lands by dragons centuries before.
Scaevola wrote:I guess this is a good moment to point out that my name is written GIULIO and not GUILIO...
Ashtagon wrote:Scaevola wrote:I guess this is a good moment to point out that my name is written GIULIO and not GUILIO...
Just change your name. Worked for me anyway
Chimpman wrote: That's one of the problems with online communities. I've known you for several years and never once had to actually speak your name... and thus never had to pronounce it correctly. I must confess that in my own head I completely drop the i in the pronunciation (which I'm sure is also completely wrong). I do apologize for the mistake.
Chimpman wrote:Scaevola wrote:GIULIO and not GUILIO
That's one of the problems with online communities. I've known you for several years and never once had to actually speak your name
Chimpman wrote:I also wanted to ask Giulio if the work by LoZompatore (some of which can be found on the Vaults at Blackmoor and Pre-Cataclysmic Mystara) was the work previously mentioned regarding post GRoF dwarven migrations?
Zendrolion wrote:Unfortunately I don't hear news from Giulio since a couple months... I hope he can jump over here soon.
Anyway, AFAIR, LoZompatore's work on the age of Blackmoor and the GRoF didn't include anything like a chart of dwarven migrations. The work did featured the dwarves' place of origin and some comments about them, but I don't recall anything about dwarven migrations besides their travel from Norwold (place of origin, according to HW precataclysmic map) to the Known World (according to canon, dwarves were already in the KW when Kagyar "modified" them; they were probably moving south from their ancestral homeland, suddendly turned very cold).
Chimpman wrote:As far as dwarven migrations go I'm leaning toward the vast majority of them coming from the NE Brunian coast in the way you suggest, but I'd like to have a small number of refugees come in from Skothar as well.
Zendrolion wrote:Seer of Yhog wrote:This is where details haven’t been nailed down, so I’m open to ideas. Is the timeframe cited above official? If so, we can push the founding of the agricultural civilisation to around 1800-1900 BC. I would prefer a “civilisational changeover” starting around BC 2000 or so.
I agree with this take about Mogreth-Nithia chronological relationship. See also my comment on Chimp's quote of the HW set timeline, below.
About the Dawners moving to the IoD around BC 2000, this isn't a canonical date of course, but it'd be difficult to have them arrive later (there are already Antalians in the Northern Reaches, and Nithians south of them). Moreover, if the Ostland landbridge collapses in BC 2000, that date is the last chance for the Dawners to get on the IoD...
And having them coming to the IoD any sooner than BC 2000 would be difficult as well for me, becouse ethnography-wise their cultural-linguistic branch is linked with that of the early Wendarian humans (not the Antalians, who came later), together with that of a Neathar-descended population of early Ethengar: in fact, I had them all parts of the same migration, stopping first in Genalleth, then in Ethengar, and finally crossing the Sea of Dawn to te IoD.
But I'm going off-topic. More about all this when I'll post my revised ethnography.
Zendrolion wrote:Chimpman wrote:I also wanted to ask Giulio if the work by LoZompatore (some of which can be found on the Vaults at Blackmoor and Pre-Cataclysmic Mystara) was the work previously mentioned regarding post GRoF dwarven migrations?
Unfortunately I don't hear news from Giulio since a couple months... I hope he can jump over here soon.
(Oruguz, The Goat, The Black Prince)
Lord of Demons, Patron of Violence
Level, Alignment, Sphere: 25 (Eternal), CE, Entropy
Symbol: a goat's head with ram horns
Although the lord of undead, Orcus is never worshiped as such in the Shimmering Lands. His faith originated with lycanthropic refugees from Taymora, and slowly infiltrated its way into many prominent merchant houses. As with Angrboda, worship in Orcus swelled circa BC 2400 when desperate dwarves turned to him for deliverance and succor.
Scaevola wrote:Hey, which one of you have used "Summon Thyatian Soldier 3"?
JohnBiles wrote:Orcus doesn't exist in 2300 BC; he was a Devil Swine in Traladara during his lifetime and Devil Swine don't exist until the 7th century AC.
The Traladarans don't exist at this point, even.
Chimpman wrote:JohnBiles wrote:Orcus doesn't exist in 2300 BC; he was a Devil Swine in Traladara during his lifetime and Devil Swine don't exist until the 7th century AC.
The Traladarans don't exist at this point, even.
Hmmm... you are right, of course... nice catch. What entropy immortal could I replace him with do you think? I've been reluctant to use Thanatos just because I think he's generally overused and wanted some new blood here.
JohnBiles wrote:Are you looking specifically for an immortal connected to undeath here?
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