[Nation] Adhuza

Rebuilding the world in the wake of the Great Rain of Fire.

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[Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:24 am

We've been talking a lot about Adhuza in the map thread, so I thought it might be a good idea to start this thread up. Let's talk about all things Adhuzan! I'll reserve space in this first post as a thread index.

Campaign Overview Excerpt

Timeline

Locations
Last edited by Chimpman on Wed Aug 04, 2010 12:33 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:29 am

Timeline

BC 3100: Aquarendi elves seek the guardianship of Manwara, an Immortal of the Sea, and enter the waters to begin a new life. [Is this possibly the kopru luring the elves into the sea to serve as pawns?]

BC 3000: Blackmoor is destroyed in the GRoF. The kopru take notice of the surface world.
Elves in Vulcania are thrust into a freezing climate shift which rapidly begins to destroy their civilization

BC XXX: Elves begin siphoning heat from within the earth in order to heat their rapidly cooling cities. Their techniques have some effect, however they also unknowingly rob the deep sea kopru cities of all of their geo-thermal heat.

BC 2800: The Azcans have shattered the Oltecs, however their victory is short lived. Their culture degrades under the aftereffects of the Great Rain of Fire, and in order to escape their impending doom they flee below ground, under the Great Escarpment. [The battles between the Azcans and Oltecs may also be indicative of Adhuzan/kopru involvement.]
Elves divide on magic versus technology. The Returnists, under Ilsundal the Wise, begin a long migration to Brun, hoping to find those elves that colonized there.

BC 2500: In Vulcania, the elven civilisation is losing its battle with the elements. A second group of southern elves, whose leader's name is now lost, takes a different route north. They rejoin Ilsundal's band and continue with them.
Taymoran humans (migrating from the northwest) settle the shores of the southern sea of Brun.

BC XXX: As their cities die, the kopru realize that they must punish the surface dwellers responsible. They set a plan in motion which will overload the elves’ volcanic terrain, burying the hated dryskins in fire and ash. The victory comes at a price however as the kopru’s own homes will grow too cold to survive in. They search for a new homeland further north.

BC XXX: The kopru discover geothermal vents around the Island of Dread and found their new kingdom of Adhuza.

BC 2400: Vulcania explodes in massive volcanic eruptions, destroying the elven civilization there and blanketing the world in a layer of black ash.

BC XXX: Oltecs make war with aranea

BC XXX: Slowly the Oltec tribes and aranea colonists come under the influence of Adhuza. They stop waging war against one another and turn their interests elsewhere.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:59 am

I was re-reading some of Sharon's HM kopru posts and picked off a couple of ideas for the Adhuzan timeline. There are a few things I'm proposing that are different from her original work however - the biggest deviation being when the kopru move their nation from Vulcania to the Isle of Dread. Sharon's original thoughts were that the kopru would move there around BC 1700, shortly after the increased volcanic activity in the area (that results in the sinking of Taymora). This is also the time frame that she has Adhuza being moved to the Hollow Moon.

I'm really latching onto the idea that the kopru were responsible for the destruction of Vulcania in BC 2400, after which they would have had to leave the area (having expended the rest of their precious thermal energy in the attack against the surface dwellers). This would place the foundation of the nation sometime between BC 2500 and BC 2400.

I think the steady geothermal build-up in the Sea of Dread area from BC 2500 to the time that Taymora sinks in BC 1750 would be enough to entice the kopru into moving there, however I think that the destruction caused by the final catastrophic event might also be enough to send them packing somewhere else. The dilemma with using this timeline is to somehow get the kopru back to Davania in order for them to put together the Adhuzan Dominarchy that will eventually be sent to the Hollow Moon (complete with Varrelyans, Minotaurs, Nithians, and others).
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Fri Jul 23, 2010 3:44 pm

@ Seer
Do you recall a discussion we had a while ago about the kopru, Varellyans and halflings? I think we were looking at your Varellyan timeline and trying to come up with logical periods of kopru dominance. I can't seem to find the discussion. Perhaps it was lost during one of the forum moves?
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Seer of Yhog » Sat Jul 24, 2010 2:53 am

Hmmm...I'll check it out this weekend (time permitting). Failing that, I should be able to come up with something cogent before mid-week. I took the day off to get some things done, but the "to-do" list grew. Funny how that happens.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:22 pm

From memory I want to say that we talked about the golden age circa BC 1700s being the period that the Varellyans were relatively free from kopru influence, but then after Thanegioth collapsed they returned and that led to the period of conquest circa BC 1400s (against the halflings, I believe).

I really need to go back and look at that timeline... I just haven't had the time recently.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Hugin » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:58 pm

Still following things. Once I have something worth adding I'll comment.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Havard » Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:05 pm

This is a pretty interesting setting/region. I would assume that Ka has quite a bit of influence here...

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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:43 pm

Havard wrote:This is a pretty interesting setting/region. I would assume that Ka has quite a bit of influence here...

Oh... I like that idea.

I'm pretty sure that the kopru would try to stamp out as much worship in real immortals as they possibly could - immortals = clerics = high wisdom = harder to mind control. They don't want the competition. I do like the idea of having other immortals on the outside of society, trying to gain or maintain a foothold in the conquered Adhuzan populations. Ka should fit in really well in the IoDread region. I can see him having followers among the Oltec descendants in the area as well as with some of the more ancient Trog clans (those that have shunned worship of the OBs).
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Havard » Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:47 pm

Chimpman wrote:
Havard wrote:This is a pretty interesting setting/region. I would assume that Ka has quite a bit of influence here...

Oh... I like that idea.

I'm pretty sure that the kopru would try to stamp out as much worship in real immortals as they possibly could - immortals = clerics = high wisdom = harder to mind control. They don't want the competition. I do like the idea of having other immortals on the outside of society, trying to gain or maintain a foothold in the conquered Adhuzan populations. Ka should fit in really well in the IoDread region. I can see him having followers among the Oltec descendants in the area as well as with some of the more ancient Trog clans (those that have shunned worship of the OBs).


I don't know what approach you will be taking with the BC2300 setting, but I like associating the Kopru with Demogogon as well. Demogorgon might be working with the Kopru to get the OB's back or there could be several factions. You would likely also have things like Devilfish hanging out in this region.

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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Tue Aug 03, 2010 4:10 pm

Havard wrote:I don't know what approach you will be taking with the BC2300 setting, but I like associating the Kopru with Demogogon as well. Demogorgon might be working with the Kopru to get the OB's back or there could be several factions. You would likely also have things like Devilfish hanging out in this region.

So far I've been basing the kopru (and Adhuza) mostly on Sharon's Hollow Moon work - though there are several areas where I intend to deviate at least somewhat from her original ideas. I know what she'd say about the kopru and immortals (or OBs for that matter) - they don't mix. Kopru are too self important to worship another being no matter what kind of power they may derive from the association. While I think I'd like that to be mostly true, I'd also like to provide some exceptions to that general rule.

I do like the Savage Tide AP, so linking Demogorgon with this area makes a lot of sense. Also given that there are dwarven worshipers of Angraboda/Demogorgon in the Shimmering Lands, this could be something that is worth delving into in more detail.

Perhaps there are factions of deviant kopru out there trying to gain an edge over their peers in some way that have sold their souls to the Prince of Demons in return for power. Such kopru would probably be seen as outcasts by their fellows - losers who can't play the Game of Thralls like a normal kopru would. But I think they would still exist... perhaps they will even play some role in the downfall of the nation in this area. In other words (even from a kopru perspective) these guys would be considered villains.

You've also hit upon another great topic for Adhuza - the Devilfish. There are definitely plans for making these guys into villains for the undersea races (and possibly even for those above the surface). Adhuza would be especially concerned with them because they could be a serious threat to their monopoly on mercantile shipping throughout the Sea of Dread region. Another idea I've toyed with in the past is that the Devilfish inherit their vampiric abilities from Taymora after it falls into the sea... so it might be the case that Devilfish in the BC 2300 era aren't vampiric at all.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Seer of Yhog » Tue Aug 03, 2010 5:53 pm

Chimpman wrote:I'm pretty sure that the kopru would try to stamp out as much worship in real immortals as they possibly could - immortals = clerics = high wisdom = harder to mind control. They don't want the competition. I do like the idea of having other immortals on the outside of society, trying to gain or maintain a foothold in the conquered Adhuzan populations. Ka should fit in really well in the IoDread region. I can see him having followers among the Oltec descendants in the area as well as with some of the more ancient Trog clans (those that have shunned worship of the OBs).


I'd agree with this idea, too. On the surface, the people of Adhuza worship a common immortal, but kopru control isn't absolute (people make their saves, some races are more susceptible than others, some Immortals might place magic items that counteract the kopru's network on controlling statues, etc.) Immortals may have their rivalries, but they would all share the view, IMO, that mortals have no business being worshipped. That's their job (and it's probably against regulations somewhere, maybe as a clause in the contract, you know, the one right below the "no scabs" rule).
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Chimpman » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:16 pm

Here is the rough draft of the Adhuzan Overview for the Campaign setting document. I've tried to keep information presented here all "player" appropriate. Those in the know should be able to tease out what is really going on under the surface, but I didn't want to spell it out directly in this excerpt.

Adhuza
Empire of the Waves
Location: Sea of Dread and Northern Davania.
Area: XXX sq. ft. (XXX sq. m.); additional notes if any
Population: Estimated XXX (X% triton, X% merrow, X% human (Oltec), X% aranea, X% phanaton, X% kna, X% other).
Languages: Twaal (Aquan), Oltec, others?
Coinage:
Taxes:
Government Type: Mercantile Dominarchy
Industries:
Important Figures:

Overview
A nation of ancient wonders ruled by triton kings from beneath the waves, the grasp of Adhuza stretches across the Sea of Dread and beyond. Once embroiled in countless wars among themselves, the nations of Adhuza have learned the arts of peace and cooperation, and working together have built up one of the strongest mercantile nations in the area. Goods and ideas flow freely across its borders, but worship of anything other than the True God is suppressed with swift and violent methods. Those that adhere to Adhuza’s dictates find themselves growing fat with wealth, but those that oppose them are cursed with madness by the nation’s enigmatic immortal patron.

Geography
Adhuza covers varied territories both above and beneath the seas, centered on the island continent of Thanegioth. From there it extends northward along the Dragon’s Maw, a gaping gash in the ocean floor surrounded east and west by sharp and dangerous reefs piercing the surface of the seas. Volcanic vents litter the region of the Boiling Sea, sending steam and smoke bubbling up from the depths to disgorge into the air. Several island chains extend from Thanegioth to the mainland, including the Shark Chain and Spider Archipelago.

Flora and Fauna
Climate from the mainland of Brun to Thanegioth changes from moderately temperate all the way to tropical, lending itself to the support of many different creatures. Few larger life forms are native to the island chains, however domesticated animals such as pig and goat have take hold on many of them and run feral. Saurian and insectoid life forms dominate Thanegioth, with some of them reaching staggering proportions.

Aquatic life also teams across the Sea of Dread and its surrounds. Fish are a staple diet of the Adhuzans and many of their neighbors, however larger and more aggressive creatures lurk in the dark depths as well. Dragon turtles are known to frequent the area and are especially dangerous to seagoing vessels that attempt passage through the region without acquiring Adhuzan permission first.

History
The sea kingdom of Adhuza emerged in this area nearly 500 years ago, just a few short centuries after the Great Rain of Fire. In the wake of the Blackmoorian disaster many countries sank into barbarity and lost the means for fast and easy transport across the oceans. Adhuza, due to its very nature has preserved this sea going mobility and used it to become one of the foremost mercantile nations in the world.

Wealth is not the only force that drove the Adhuzans however, for they also have a rigid and structured sense of order. This led them to take a great interest in the land dwelling communities on islands throughout the Sea of Dread and on the shores that it bordered. In the centuries since the Great Rain of Fire there have been many wars and battles, but where the Adhuzan’s come, peace soon follows. They have absorbed kingdoms both above and below the surface of the waves, including the shark-kin of the Dragon’s Maw, Oltecs of XXX, and the Aranean Isles.

Peoples
The Twaal tritons are the undisputed rulers of Adhuza, having first united their own people shortly after the Great Rain of Fire and then subsequently conquering savage tribes of neighboring merrow. Other sea races have flocked to the stability and safety of the coral cities and have been welcomed there as well. Semi-nomadic kna traverse the sea floor in lengthy caravans, sea giants perform as laborers in the cities and act as special enforcers in the armies of the Twaal. Even the enigmatic kopru have found a role in Adhuzan society, serving as a priestly class, maintaining volcanic temples to Adhuza M’Thaz and leading the faithful in his adoration.

Though often savage and brutal, shark-kin also hold a special place in Adhuzan society. Their ancestral homes are centered on the eastern isles of the Dragon’s Maw, but shark-kin can be found dispersed throughout the underwater realm. Their savagery makes them excellent soldiers, and their ability to tread land has aided many of the recent conquests of surface dwellers in the area.

Oltecs and aranea are more recent additions to the empire, occupying the surface of the many islands in the region. Survivors of the Oltec-Azcan wars before the Great Rain of Fire, the Oltecs have been struggling for survival ever since. The aranea have been in the area for much longer, descendants of colonists sent out from Old Aran millennia ago.

Customs
Adhuza is divided into several satrapies, each one governed by a local satrap. Although each satrap must eventually answer to the Twaal King, they are left largely to their own devices. In many cases for conquered people, life goes much as it had before the coming of the Twaal, though the eyes and ears of the empire lie everywhere.

Cultural practices vary widely from one satrapy to another, however many share a few core traits. The taking of slaves is frowned upon, and most Adhuzans would find the practice distasteful to say the least. Honesty and truthfulness are held in high esteem throughout the empire, as is law and order.

Religion
Adhuzans practice a dualistic religion devoted to their patron Adhuza M’Thaz (for whom they name their nation) in his efforts to overcome his wicked and hated rival O’Hmarn. Both immortals of thought, Adhuza M’Thaz held two elements in the highest esteem, Water and Fire, believing that all creatures derived from them were of the most worth and pure sort. His opponent O’Hmarn instead held that Air and Earth were sacred. Thus the two are locked in an endless battle, forever disputing the sacredness of their chosen elements. Some say that the empire building of the Twaal tritons is merely an extension of this ancient conflict.

For Adhuzans, the most sacred of places are those containing both the elements of Water and Fire. Many of their temples are built around deep sea thermal vents or island volcanoes nestled away in the vastness of the Sea of Dread. Wherever they go, Adhuzans always bring some physical representation of their patron with them wherever they go, and all major temples have as their centerpiece a giant statue of their god.

Settlements of Note
Suthus (pop. XXX): Built in the midst of the Boiling Sea, the city of Suthus has thrived over the ensuing centuries and is known throughout Adhuza as a city of learning and religious piety. Recent decades have seen the city’s population explode, mainly due to swelling from without, and soldiers swimming through its columns have become a common sight. The heart of the city bubbles and roils with dark smoky clouds tearing their way through the waters to reach the surface, caressing the gigantic statue of Adhuza M’Thaz on their journey.

Thanegea (pop. XXX): Newly appointed as the nation’s capital only recently, Thanegea was designed as a meeting place for all the races of Adhuza, aquatic and land dweller alike. Built on an island in the middle of a lake on the central plateau of Thanegioth, the city is connected to the old empire beneath the waves through a series of aquatic tunnels that stretch all the way beneath the island to the sea.

??? (pop. XXX): Old Twaal capital?

Appearance and Dress
Although each nation in the empire has its own dress, most of them favor light clothing. Those living in the Sea of Dread region often favor light, airy fabrics, in bright colors, cut short enough to prevent heat exhaustion. In many cases this means they wear little more than loin cloths and gauzy tunics.

Aquatic races and the aranea wear even less, both opting for functional harness and belts allowing them to carry any essential supplies or tools. Oltecs tend to decorate their clothing with bright feathers and animal pelts, and this trend has swept across the rest of the nation, modifying local customs to one degree or another.

Weapons and Armor
Just like its peoples, the weapons and armors of Adhuza are exotic and varied. Aranean silk armor is popular among the folk living on many of the islands in the Sea of Dread. It is durable and lightweight, which makes it a favorite among sailors who can afford it. Lamellar wood armor is also common, especially among the Oltecs of the main island. Shells and bones make up the majority of armors in the area, especially those used by the undersea races.

Brine steel weapons are often grown in the shape of spears and harpoons and are commonly found in undersea cities and coastal communities. These living weapons are actually shards of coral. They are stronger than most bronze weapons equivalents, but require immersion in briny water every night in order to maintain their tensile strength.

Blades crafted from Fire Quartz fare much better on the surface world, however their use is typically restricted to the Adhuzan religious caste. These crystal shards are used as spear and arrow heads, but also commonly appear in bladed weapons such as daggers and short swords.

Foreign Relations
For nearly two centuries the Twaal merfolk have had contact with various dwarven factions, having especially strong ties with the folk dwelling in Qivar. They also have limited dealings further south in the lands of Mogreth, and are on friendly terms with a handful of the more primitive frogfolk tribes living in Rumog Swamp.

With the elves of Vulcania and their erstwhile migrants, the Adhuzans are on less friendly terms. Rumors abound that the Twaal once served as trusted advisors to elves departing from their homeland on Davania, but the two peoples had a falling out shortly afterward. Now elven ships openly defy Adhuzan laws, sailing through their territory without escort or leave.

The Adhuzans and Taymorans share a grudging respect with each other. While the Taymorans are definitely from a more fractured society they have withstood the many attempts made by the Adhuzans to subsume them into the empire. Both nations have mercantile interests across southern Brun, and while Adhuza controls the waterways, Taymora dominates all inland trade routes. Taymoran religion is abhorrent to most Adhuzans, who despise both their Great Bull of the Earth as well as their reliance upon undead minions.

Of the other races, the Adhuzans know of and care for little. For the most part the giants and elves on Brun stay far inland, and rarely make contact. Of the deep elves they are completely oblivious, and the humanoids of Urzud range too far to the west to be of much concern.

Names

Language
The language commonly spoken in Adhuza is the Twaal dialect of Aquan. In addition to this many of the satrapies also speak their own native tongues, but the Twaal patios is what binds them all together.

Character Classes
Second only to the nobility in Adhuza are the merchants. Those that aspire to wealth and power are practiced in the art of using honeyed words and carrying a sharp blade behind their backs. Those who cannot master such skills often serve their merchant masters in other ways. Shark-kin of the Dragon’s Maw are known especially well as mercenaries and strong-arms throughout the empire.

Wizards are also respected, whether they dwell in the deep sea vents of Suthus or tread across the silken lines of Arana. Many such wizards become masters of water and fire magic, as is proscribed by the Adhuzan religion, and in fact the religious orders are run almost exclusively by such folk. True clerics are few and far between in Adhuza, and most worship gods other than Adhuza M’Thaz.

After 2300 BC
The Adhuzan empire crumbles shortly after the geological upheavals that cause large portions of the main island to sink beneath the waves (forming the Thanegioth Archipelago) in BC 1720. The Twaal population splits in two with half traveling to the newly formed Sunlit Sea and the other half moving into the deeper waters north of Davania. The two groups make war with one another, as well as with the nomadic bands of devilfish that plague the area, for centuries.

Surface dwellers living on the islands in the Sea of Dread are devastated. A few manage to migrate to more stable areas on the Isle of Dawn or the Savage Coast. Many others fall into a life of savagery and barbarism, never recovering from their losses even in the modern era.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby happylarry » Wed Aug 11, 2010 12:19 am

This is looking really good - looking forward to more

and this...

Thanegea (pop. XXX): Newly appointed as the nation’s capital only recently, Thanegea was designed as a meeting place for all the races of Adhuza, aquatic and land dweller alike. Built on an island in the middle of a lake on the central plateau of Thanegioth, the city is connected to the old empire beneath the waves through a series of aquatic tunnels that stretch all the way beneath the island to the sea.


has given me lots of ideas for expanding X1, which I'll come back to soon (players will be going there in the next month or two)
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Sturm » Tue Feb 11, 2014 2:59 pm

Posting here as me and Zendrolion discussed the matter of human migrations in the Thanegioth area in several notes of his article for issue 3 of Threshold magazine... I'm copying the conclusion of the discussion here as it's worth preserving, even if part of it should be included in The History of Ierendi and Minrothad that will appear in the issue:

He: Ok, let's see if I can make things consistent as much as possible with your take. We have the Oteino (post-Azcans) living in the Ierendi area; then the Eokai (Neathar M-Cycladic and Maltean); and then the Mawa (M-Polynesians - likely Oltec or Tanagoro/Oltec mix).
Now, the Oteino are ok for me, and I can substitute my Ti-teque with them.
About the Mawa, until now I derived M-Polynesian culture from human populations under Rakasta influence, becouse at least two Rakasta breeds (sherkasta and cloud pardasta) have an Indonesian and Malay language (belonging to the same Austronesian family of M-Polynesian), and there are M-Austronesian states on Patera. So, compromise could be the following: pre-GRoF a human population was dominated by Rakasta in Skothar and adopted a similar tongue. That population later (still pre-GRoF) expanded in the Oceania-Cestia-Sea of Steam area, up to the Pearl Islands. After the GRoF they reached northern Davania and the Sea of Dread - I'd call Mawa this last branch of the migration.
Lastly, the Eokai then could come from Davania instead that from the north (see one of your following comments, also).
Thus modern Makai culture develops after BC 1600 from the union of Eokai, Oteino, and Mawa, while the Makai-like culture of the islands of the Sea of Dread lacks the Oteino contribution.
What do you think? This picture should work even if I use a KW-North Pole precataclysmic version. Otherwise, do you think there are other possibilities to link M-Polynesians and Rakasta?

Me: It works perfectly to me too. I like too the connection between rakastas and oriental cultures, even if IMC I haven't decided yet who influenced who.. not really important IMO... then we could have in Ierendi a Eokai-Oteino-Mawa culture, in the Thanegioth area a Eokai-Mawa culture and in the Pearl Island I suppose a Tanagoro-Mawa culture...
Addendum, as I'm reading The Empire of the Firelord adventure by Ville Lahde... he mentions Nuari as living in the Thanegioth area... I left a comment in his article too but IIRC there were two different human people in X1 too... the Thanegioth area then should have the Makai (Mawa-Eokai only) and the Nuari too... the Nuari would be a Mawa-Tanagoro mix that arrived in Thanegioth later (after 1000 BC as per HW migration map)... Correct?

He: "Yes; black skinned migrants in the Sea of Dread could well be Yavi, not necessarily Nuari. Anyway, the picture would be the following:
* BC 3500-2500 = Eokai come in northern Davania from the Serpent Peninsula, then from there in the Sea of Dread area
* BC 2800-2500 = Oteino (descendants of Azcans) expand the northern Sea of Dread
* BC 3000-2500 = Mawa come from Cestia/Jungle Coast/Pearl Islands area to the southern Sea of Dread
* BC 2500-1600 = Mawa come to the northern Sea of Dread
* BC 1600 = Makai culture (Oteino+Eokai+Mawa) formed in northern Sea of Dread
* BC 1000 = Tanagoro migrate to the Pearl Islands and absorb the Mawa there (=Nuari)
* After BC 1000 = Nuari/Yavi migrate to the Sea of Dread area; if these are indeed Nuari, Alphatian expansion could be the cause behind their migration
So in the end we would have the Sea of Dread people as a mix (don't know how much "mixed" really) of Neathar (Eokai), Oltec (Mawa), and Tanagoro (Nuari/Yavi) cultures."

Me: "Sorry, I forgot to mention that I see Oteino as predating the azcan, they would be indeed the very first "oltec" migration from Skothar toward the west... so you could have both oteino and descendants of the azcan contributing to the makai people, but maybe that's not too much relevant for the article..
About Nuari and Yavi, they could be both...it would be indeed interesting to have two different tanagoro related subcultures in the thanegioth area.. but also this I think it's not really important for the purpose of the article...
For me it can be resolved, but I'll save in the forum (2300BC Adhuza thread) part of this discussion as it's really important for the topic! Thanks!"

He: About the Oteino, I'm not sure I can follow you here... I have the hearth of Oltec culture/empire in the Great Waste/Black Mountains, so it's easy to derive the Oteino from the surviving, nearby Azcans after BC 3000. And before BC 3000 there is little reason to migrate in the KW, becouse in my version it's the North Pole. Anyway, the thing is to be discussed further, but since it would be difficult to explain all this properly in the article, I'll be as vague as possible about the topic in order to leave more than one road opened, as always! :-)
I'll include, instead, the double Yavi/Nuari origin of the Sea of Dread's black-skinned men.
Regarding the Adhuza thread, feel free to include everything there. I'll try to contribute as much as possible if I have more time in the future. ;-)
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Gecko » Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:37 pm

So if I followed that correctly, and then extrapolated another step-

The Makai in Ierendi would be the M-Polynesians
The "Makai" in the Thanegioth would be the M-Micronesians
and the Nuari in the Pearl Islands would be the M-Melanesians (spelling?)
right?

I like it, though others might not because it removes the Nuari as the M-Maori as some see them.
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Re: [Nation] Adhuza

Postby Sturm » Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:17 am

Well, I suppose that comparison could work fine, even if in earth the story is a bit different as melanesian should be the first migration.. Actually I would put a melanesian-like people somewhere in the islands south of Skothar (sea kingdoms of the Master map). There I'd also put M-Maori and other M-oceanian people..
Like other places in Mystara also the seas from the sea kingdoms to thanegia should have seen a lot of migrations... lhomarrians (M-atlanteans) at first, then oltecs people, then the Mawa (M-polynesian), then tanagoros, maybe a little of varellyans (M-phoenicians), nithians and milenians, so several mixed people could live in the area...
In 2300 BC oltecs and mawa should already live in Thanegia... here I think Chimpman assumed there were only oltecs at first, Zendrolion instead would put here only Eokai and Mawa (Neathar+M-polynesian), I'd would be inclined to put all three people in the island, that will later evolve and merge in a Makai like people (that however should have another similar but not identical name...)
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