Dragons of 2300 BC

Rebuilding the world in the wake of the Great Rain of Fire.

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Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Wed Oct 20, 2010 10:59 pm

You know it had to happen sooner or later! Lets see if we can come up with a Who's Who of Dragons in the BC 2300 era.

Veritaph (aka Great Bull of the Sky) - Adult Gold Dragon
Ehrssus (Heir of Soolkhir) - Young Adult Green/Jade Dragon
Yrrghvillid (Snow Blood) - Ancient White
Last edited by Chimpman on Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:24 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:00 pm

Veritaph (aka Great Bull of the Sky) - Adult Gold Dragon
Covered in shimmering gold scales tinged with a touch of ochre, Veritaph’s horns curl outward slightly more than normal for his species. He often uses illusions to disguise himself as a giant bull when flying through the sky, snorting and covered in fire, but assumes other personas when the mood takes him. To the priests of the Cult of the Bull, he is the titan Wideshiros, Herald of the Great Bull in the Earth, and in merchant circles of Tamoraz and Soleclea he is known as Yidaros the Golden, a purveyor of elven goods from beyond the Sea of Dread. Whatever form he takes, Veritaph enjoys covering it with the richest trappings, from brightly dyed silks to gem encrusted jewelry.

Veritaph’s expanse covers much of the eastern Taymoran basin ranging from Soleclea to Tycur and encompassing portions of the Noctis Labyrinthus in the north all the way to the XXX Bay in the south. His layer is secreted away deep in the heart of Mount Taur, the birthplace of the Cult of the Bull, from which he emerges either as a great flying bull to roam across the lands, or as a titan from the earth to give out the proclamations of his “god”.

Many lizardman tribes in the swamps north of Pseiros swear fealty to Veritaph, who often directs them in raids against their Taymoran neighbors. He also has great influence among the maritime merchants in the area, and those that oppose him often find their ships attacked by small flights of young green or black dragons. Veritaph’s crowning achievement however, has been his infiltration into and manipulation of the Cult of the Bull. Not only does he use the priesthood to impose his will upon local Taymoran settlements, but the Temple of Mount Taur is a pilgrimage destination for Taymorans from across the nation, giving Veritaph an opportunity to expand his influence across most of southern Brun.

The vampire queens of Taymora, especially those ruling over the southern city states, and the Adhuzan priesthood, both find Veritaph to be an extremely dangerous nuisance. On several occasions both groups have hired adventurers to find the dragon’s lair and deal with him, but so far none have had much success. Veritaph also clashes with the black dragon Hierophonem who dwells in the swamps below the Curicanti Mountains to the north. The two both vie for the worship of the scattered lizardmen tribes in the area. His greatest and most ancient adversary however, is the red dragon Alfiernia, who lives on the isles in the Boiling Sea. Veritaph suspects that she has recently struck a deal with the Adhuzans to help them hunt him down.

Modern descendants: Hytiliaph
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:19 am

Cool idea.
It might be worth considering using some links to the Dragons of Blackmoor in this project. Just a thought :)

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:35 am

Havard wrote:Cool idea.
It might be worth considering using some links to the Dragons of Blackmoor in this project. Just a thought :)

That is a great idea. Is there a thread somewhere that I missed or is that information found in an actual product?
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Seer of Yhog » Thu Oct 21, 2010 2:40 pm

I like this! It makes perfect sense that creatures as powerful (and egotistical) as dragons would openly step into a power vacuum and take a stab at rulership or pseudo-godhood - whatever floats their boat. Compared to the modern era, where the KW is more or less entirely claimed (but not necessarily controlled) by nations, and human civilisations are more advanced (and therefore more likely to mount an effective response), the period of BC 2300 would be relatively virgin territory.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Hugin » Thu Oct 21, 2010 3:00 pm

Great idea chimpman! This opens up the opportunity to examine the reactions of dragons to the GRoF. How did they react? What did they do and why did they do it?
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:08 pm

Seer of Yhog wrote:I like this! It makes perfect sense that creatures as powerful (and egotistical) as dragons would openly step into a power vacuum and take a stab at rulership or pseudo-godhood - whatever floats their boat. Compared to the modern era, where the KW is more or less entirely claimed (but not necessarily controlled) by nations, and human civilisations are more advanced (and therefore more likely to mount an effective response), the period of BC 2300 would be relatively virgin territory.

Exactly. Not all dragons would behave this way of course, but I think that the modern day constraints that prevent them from doing more of this kind of thing are really lessened in this time period (for the reasons you mention above).

Hugin wrote:Great idea chimpman! This opens up the opportunity to examine the reactions of dragons to the GRoF. How did they react? What did they do and why did they do it?

Now... this is a very intriguing idea (and I'm a little upset I didn't think of it myself ;) ), but you are right - this is the perfect opportunity to explore how dragons reacted to the GRoF. I don't have a ton of time, but my initial thought would be that many dragons (if they avoided the initial blast, and once they figured out what was going on) could have begun a special Ritual of Sublimation - basically sacrificing their hoard in order to protect their own lives.

The results of such a ritual could have had a few different outcomes:
1) Everything goes as planned, and the dragon enters into a deep slumber that protects him from the worst effects of the Wasting disease that follows the GRoF. Once they wake up, the worst has passed and they are free to resume their normal activities. Of course slumbering dragons might be susceptible to other dangers... roaming bands of humanoids would probably be looking for shelter from the fallout and caves are a logical place to look - so many dragons might end up killed in their sleep in this case.

2) The dragon survives, but something goes terribly wrong. Perhaps the fallout from the GRoF interacts with the Ritual of Sublimation in such a way as to transform the dragon into something entirely new. Perhaps they devolve into a slavering monster, or maybe they become a super intelligent mutant. The sky is pretty much the limit!

Other dragons may have chosen to ride out the storm, in which case they may have suffered from the Wasting just like all the other mortals on the planet. We might be looking at a period in history where dracoliches are extremely common because many dragons turn to undeath in order to escape the Radiance fallout (mimicking what happens in Taymora). In fact, after only 700 years from the GRoF, many dragons who actually experienced the disaster (even as fully fledged adults) could still be alive. They would become a great source of (possibly forbidden) knowledge of Blackmoor.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:34 pm

Chimpman wrote:
Havard wrote:Cool idea.
It might be worth considering using some links to the Dragons of Blackmoor in this project. Just a thought :)

That is a great idea. Is there a thread somewhere that I missed or is that information found in an actual product?


Im working on a more extensive writeup, but mainly the three Dragon Immortals of that age:
Chamber (NE)
Insellageth (NG)
Tsartha (N)

I would assume that some, if not all of them were destroyed in the Great Rain of Fire though...

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Hugin » Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:26 pm

Chimpman wrote:Other dragons may have chosen to ride out the storm, in which case they may have suffered from the Wasting just like all the other mortals on the planet. We might be looking at a period in history where dracoliches are extremely common because many dragons turn to undeath in order to escape the Radiance fallout (mimicking what happens in Taymora). In fact, after only 700 years from the GRoF, many dragons who actually experienced the disaster (even as fully fledged adults) could still be alive. They would become a great source of (possibly forbidden) knowledge of Blackmoor.

Good thoughts. Dragon liches had popped into my mind too, as well perhaps some of the "dragon-kin" creatures.

What about their colours? Do we have all the various colours of dragons prior to the GRoF? What if some of those who sleep 'absorbed' some of the environment that surrounded them, creating some link between them and their environment, explaining their affinity to these kinds of locations, their colour, and their various breath-weapons. Just exploring here...
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Fri Oct 22, 2010 4:22 pm

Hugin wrote:What about their colours? Do we have all the various colours of dragons prior to the GRoF? What if some of those who sleep 'absorbed' some of the environment that surrounded them, creating some link between them and their environment, explaining their affinity to these kinds of locations, their colour, and their various breath-weapons. Just exploring here...

Yeah, that's a great idea! I think we need to do some GazH type research here and see how many canon references we can find to dragons in official sources (probably makes sense to look in Blackmoor sources as well). I wonder if the same explanation could be used for gem dragons as well.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Fri Oct 22, 2010 4:28 pm

Gem stone dragons won't be around, but other than that I suspect that there were actually more dragon varieties around before the GRoF than after.

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Fri Oct 22, 2010 5:57 pm

Havard wrote:
Chimpman wrote:
Havard wrote:Cool idea.
It might be worth considering using some links to the Dragons of Blackmoor in this project. Just a thought :)

That is a great idea. Is there a thread somewhere that I missed or is that information found in an actual product?


Im working on a more extensive writeup, but mainly the three Dragon Immortals of that age:
Chamber (NE)
Insellageth (NG)
Tsartha (N)

I would assume that some, if not all of them were destroyed in the Great Rain of Fire though...

Thanks Havard!
Ok, I've been thinking about this, but it seems like there might be some story behind the scenes that I'm not aware of (but I'm very interested in finding out). Why would you say that some or all of the Dragon Rulers were destroyed in the GRoF? What's happening behind the scenes that would cause this and why would the Dragon Rulers be singled out in such a way (as opposed to all the other immortals)?

I have to say I also like the idea of having artifacts of these three dead immortals left around in the BC 2300 era. If the Dragon Rulers are destroyed in the GRoF, then perhaps this creates a flurry of activity in the mortal dragons on the Prime who begin some big draconic game in order to compete to fill those slots. After 700 years it could be feasible that one or more of the dragons on Mystara are ready to ascend to immortaldom.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Fri Oct 22, 2010 8:27 pm

Chimpman wrote:
Im working on a more extensive writeup, but mainly the three Dragon Immortals of that age:
Chamber (NE)
Insellageth (NG)
Tsartha (N)

I would assume that some, if not all of them were destroyed in the Great Rain of Fire though...

Thanks Havard!
Ok, I've been thinking about this, but it seems like there might be some story behind the scenes that I'm not aware of (but I'm very interested in finding out). Why would you say that some or all of the Dragon Rulers were destroyed in the GRoF? What's happening behind the scenes that would cause this and why would the Dragon Rulers be singled out in such a way (as opposed to all the other immortals)?
[/quote]

My main reason for suggesting this is simply that they do not exist in modern times. My assumption is that alot of Immortals faded around the time after the GRoF. Not much beyond that. Of course, there could be other circumstances, as you mention here. That could have some potential.

An alternative scenario here is that only Chamber and Tsartha were destroyed, while Insellageth went on to become the Great One Dragon, that we know in Mystara lore. That makes alot of sense actually.

I have to say I also like the idea of having artifacts of these three dead immortals left around in the BC 2300 era. If the Dragon Rulers are destroyed in the GRoF, then perhaps this creates a flurry of activity in the mortal dragons on the Prime who begin some big draconic game in order to compete to fill those slots. After 700 years it could be feasible that one or more of the dragons on Mystara are ready to ascend to immortaldom.


Draconic artifacts are definately interesting. :cool:

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Hugin » Mon Oct 25, 2010 2:46 pm

Chimpman wrote:Yeah, that's a great idea! I think we need to do some GazH type research here and see how many canon references we can find to dragons in official sources (probably makes sense to look in Blackmoor sources as well). I wonder if the same explanation could be used for gem dragons as well.

I agree that we should do some research into dragon history on Mystara, and to see what bits of info we have about them.

If anyone has any such notes or comments we'd appreciate you sharing them.

I don't immediately see anything regarding the history or back-story of gemstone dragons. They appear to be minor variations of the chromatic dragons. Why do you think they would exist?
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:45 pm

Hugin wrote:I don't immediately see anything regarding the history or back-story of gemstone dragons. They appear to be minor variations of the chromatic dragons. Why do you think they would exist?


The Dragonlord Trilogy is the main source on the origins of Gemstone Dragons. I am not sure, but my impression is that they became Gemstone Dragons while under the influence of the Overlord on the Outer Planes, and only arrived on Mystara in their current form whenever the DL series are set AC600s?

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Mon Oct 25, 2010 11:24 pm

Havard wrote:
Hugin wrote:I don't immediately see anything regarding the history or back-story of gemstone dragons. They appear to be minor variations of the chromatic dragons. Why do you think they would exist?


The Dragonlord Trilogy is the main source on the origins of Gemstone Dragons. I am not sure, but my impression is that they became Gemstone Dragons while under the influence of the Overlord on the Outer Planes, and only arrived on Mystara in their current form whenever the DL series are set AC600s?

Ahh... that's good to know, and something I wasn't aware of. So gemstone dragons should probably be other planar in origin. That gives me something to play with in regard to a few of my other projects as well (most notably my Exiles Campaign). It also might not prohibit us from having Gemstone dragons around in this era - assuming that they are one offs who have wandered in from some other plane.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Zendrolion » Tue Oct 26, 2010 12:19 pm

Havard wrote:
Hugin wrote:I don't immediately see anything regarding the history or back-story of gemstone dragons. They appear to be minor variations of the chromatic dragons. Why do you think they would exist?


The Dragonlord Trilogy is the main source on the origins of Gemstone Dragons. I am not sure, but my impression is that they became Gemstone Dragons while under the influence of the Overlord on the Outer Planes, and only arrived on Mystara in their current form whenever the DL series are set AC600s?


Gemstone Dragons originate from a cabal of ambitious dragons who, in the Blackmoor era, manage through powerful magics to improve themselves, becoming more powerful in arcane magic and supernatural powers. In order to dominate Mystara, they trigger a war between the Blackmoor Empire and other dragons, during which the First Dragonlord sees his rise. Then (but not before the dragons are nearly exterminated) the Gemstones treachery is discovered, and the dragons join forces with the Blackmoorians against them. The Gemstones are defeated and exiled in the outer plane of Veydra.

An unknown number of centuries later, the being known as the Overlord conquers Veydra and mentally enslaves the Gemstone Dragons, making them the generals of his army, which invades Mystara at the beginning of the 6th century AC (according to LoZompatore's calculations, the first novel should take place in AC 504, and the third should end in AC 513). The Overlord's army is defeated and himself destroyed thanks to Thelvyn/Thelvaenir/Diamond, and the few Gemstones surviving the war are freed from the Overlord's control and allowed to live on Mystara.

I wrote a long history of dragonkind the last year, which is nearly complete, and which tries to collate the different version of dragonkind origin and history. I'll have to publish it one day or another...

My opinion, anyway, is that there shouldn't be Gemstone Dragons on Mystara between BC 3200 (the approximate date of their exile) and AC 513.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Hugin » Tue Oct 26, 2010 2:26 pm

Zendrolion wrote:My opinion, anyway, is that there shouldn't be Gemstone Dragons on Mystara between BC 3200 (the approximate date of their exile) and AC 513.

Thanks for the back-story, Zen (and really looking forward to your dragonkind history!). I don't have any issue with the absence of gemstone dragons during this time frame at all.

What this does imply though, as far as I can tell, is that we can't use the GRoF to explain the colour variety of dragons. I base that on the fact that gemstone dragons originate from the chromatics pre-GRoF. That's too bad in a way, I was really liking that explanation.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Tue Oct 26, 2010 3:53 pm

Ditto on the thanks Zen, that is a great explanation for someone (myself) who has not read the Dragonlord books.
Hugin wrote:What this does imply though, as far as I can tell, is that we can't use the GRoF to explain the colour variety of dragons. I base that on the fact that gemstone dragons originate from the chromatics pre-GRoF. That's too bad in a way, I was really liking that explanation.

I agree... but that doesn't mean we can't use that explanation for other dragon colors, especially the more obscure ones. Browns, yellows, purples, deep dragons, fang dragons, etc... there could still be quite a few variations that we could "create" during the fallout of the GRoF.

Hmmm... with all the elves fleeing underground at this time, I kind of like the idea of deep dragons being the descendants of normal dragons doing the same...
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Havard » Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:32 pm

Zendrolion wrote:Gemstone Dragons originate from a cabal of ambitious dragons who, in the Blackmoor era, manage through powerful magics to improve themselves, becoming more powerful in arcane magic and supernatural powers. In order to dominate Mystara, they trigger a war between the Blackmoor Empire and other dragons, during which the First Dragonlord sees his rise. Then (but not before the dragons are nearly exterminated) the Gemstones treachery is discovered, and the dragons join forces with the Blackmoorians against them. The Gemstones are defeated and exiled in the outer plane of Veydra.


Brilliant Zendrolion! For some reason I assumed that their ascention to Gemstone-ness happened during their excile. The fact that they achieved this in the Blackmoor era actually fits really well with some other concepts floating about...

I will start a thread about this in the Blackmoor Forum. :)

I wrote a long history of dragonkind the last year, which is nearly complete, and which tries to collate the different version of dragonkind origin and history. I'll have to publish it one day or another...


I do remember that. It was an excellent article!

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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:07 pm

Havard wrote:
Zen wrote:I wrote a long history of dragonkind the last year, which is nearly complete, and which tries to collate the different version of dragonkind origin and history. I'll have to publish it one day or another...


I do remember that. It was an excellent article!

Is that posted anywhere (on the Vaults perhaps)? I'd love to take a look at it.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Gecko » Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:03 am

Chimpman wrote:
Havard wrote:
Zen wrote:I wrote a long history of dragonkind the last year, which is nearly complete, and which tries to collate the different version of dragonkind origin and history. I'll have to publish it one day or another...


I do remember that. It was an excellent article!

Is that posted anywhere (on the Vaults perhaps)? I'd love to take a look at it.


I know portions or somesuch was on the old Italian forum under the thread title "Razze di Mystara (01): Draghi ed Eldar", right? If so I've got a copy of that thread through post 48 saved on my computer.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Zendrolion » Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:29 am

Gecko wrote:I know portions or somesuch was on the old Italian forum under the thread title "Razze di Mystara (01): Draghi ed Eldar", right? If so I've got a copy of that thread through post 48 saved on my computer.


Exactly, as long as I remember I didn't post any part of it on The Piazza. Moreover, I had a long and interesting discussion with other Italian MMB posters, Marco Dalmonte in particular, who suggested some corrections and alterations to the story I wrote. Unfortunately I have still not implemented my writeup with these; as that history of dragonkind could be of some interest mostly as a way to put together some sparse and conflictual sources, I'll see if I can finish it as soon as possible and post it here (the great thing is that it's already in English! ;) ).
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:42 pm

Zendrolion wrote:
Gecko wrote:I know portions or somesuch was on the old Italian forum under the thread title "Razze di Mystara (01): Draghi ed Eldar", right? If so I've got a copy of that thread through post 48 saved on my computer.


Exactly, as long as I remember I didn't post any part of it on The Piazza. Moreover, I had a long and interesting discussion with other Italian MMB posters, Marco Dalmonte in particular, who suggested some corrections and alterations to the story I wrote. Unfortunately I have still not implemented my writeup with these; as that history of dragonkind could be of some interest mostly as a way to put together some sparse and conflictual sources, I'll see if I can finish it as soon as possible and post it here (the great thing is that it's already in English! ;) ).

:cool: I'm very interested in seeing this Zen.
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Re: Dragons of 2300 BC

Postby Chimpman » Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:52 pm

Ehrssus (Heir of Soolkhir) - Young Adult Green/Jade Dragon
Every aspect of Ehrssus is twisted, from her crooked snout to her tail, twisted and bent in several directions. Even the emerald green scales of Ehrssus’ hide are slightly curled, and flare outward making the dragon appear to be covered with thousands of tiny spines. Along her joints, and outlining the features in her face, the scales darken in color until they appear to be almost black. Ehrssus has taken to the practice of embedding gems in her hide, many of them magical in nature. Folk of the northern Frontierlands call her the Obsidian Horror, and tales of her fantastic and sinister Obsidian Library abound. In southern Mogreth she is known as Zhorostam K'ha, the Green Death, while those in Theliir know her by her given name.

Ehrssus’ lair is located at the base of the Kuuromaresha Mountains near the midpoint of that range. Her domain extends southward to cover large portions of the Frontierlands and eastward to the forests of Theliir. Ehrssus also makes many forays over the Kuuromaresha and into Mogreth, although she makes no claims on the territories within that nation. Centuries ago Ehrssus was Soolkhir’s star apprentice. While most of her contemporaries were slain during their Rituals of Rebirth (many by Ehrssus herself), she managed to complete her ritual using a green dragon’s egg. Still vulnerable as a youngling, Ehrssus fled Mogreth to live in the wild until she could once again build up her power base.

In her Obsidian lair, Ehrssus is served by a tribe of degenerate troglodyte brutes, and several other nearby tribes will flock to her call in times of need. She has a network of spies reporting to her throughout the Forntierlands and Mogreth, as well as a handful in eastern Taymora. In addition to these more mundane servants, Ehrssus has also built up a small cadre of wizardly apprentices, to who she teaches her less prized arts. Despite her new found strength and longevity, Ehrssus is keenly aware that her draconic body is still mortal, and to that end has been spending most of her time trying to unlock Soolkhirs deepest secrets, so far without much luck.

Khalgoth of Theliir employs Ehrssus on occasion, as well as her spy network, but has no love for the creature. He suspects her true nature and has taken several precautions to defend his territory against the dragon should her intentions toward Mogreth change. Other dragons in the area despise Ehrssus, who is a known egg pilferer that routinely targets young dragons and nestlings for destruction. Any dragon coming into contact with her flies into a fit of rage, and will attack her relentlessly.

See also: Legend of Soolkhir
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