[Movie] Venom (2018)

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Havard
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[Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:52 pm

New trailer out today: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9Mv98Gr5pY

I'd say it looks better than I feared. Tom Hardy is a solid actor. Still, I am not really sure what to think of this one.

Is anyone here excited for the Venom movie?

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Dread Delgath » Wed Aug 01, 2018 1:10 am

I think its gonna sell pretty well, but I wish it had clung a little closer to comics canon, and had a little more crossover opportunity built in with the rest of the Sony continuity. Maybe it will, I'm not up on the latest with this one.
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Seethyr » Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:04 am

I’m very excited but angry in some ways too. First off, Amy Pascal is known for destroying fan favorite movies, and whose brainchild is it to have Venom without Spidey? Sony simply needs to leave the movie making to Feige and reap whatever monetary benefits they can from a deal with Marvel Studios. Ugh, I’m aggravated because Venom has always been a favorite character of mine.

Honestly, I’m hoping it’s “good enough” that Feige takes an interest in bringing it into the MCU and putting him up against Tom Holland’s Spider-Man.
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Angel Tarragon » Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:01 pm

I am looking forward to it, but I won't be seeing it in the theater. I'll buy the 4K when it gets a home media release.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:12 pm

Seethyr wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:04 am
I’m very excited but angry in some ways too. First off, Amy Pascal is known for destroying fan favorite movies, and whose brainchild is it to have Venom without Spidey? Sony simply needs to leave the movie making to Feige and reap whatever monetary benefits they can from a deal with Marvel Studios. Ugh, I’m aggravated because Venom has always been a favorite character of mine.

Honestly, I’m hoping it’s “good enough” that Feige takes an interest in bringing it into the MCU and putting him up against Tom Holland’s Spider-Man.

This is Sony's backup plan in case the Spider-Man deal with Disney isn't renewed after the Homecoming Sequel (Far From Home).

I am sure MCU's Kevin Feige would love to use Venom, but I don't think he will allow Sony to use their shared characters in movies that he isn't in control of. I also think he would prefer to be in charge of casting.

That said, it might be interesting if Sony manages to get a sort of parallell Spider-Verse going. They had plans for other movies in this universe such as Silver and Black (Silver Sable and Black Cat), but those plans seem to have been scrapped for now.

The most important thing for me is that Sony and Disney agree to extend the deal so that we can have more Tom Holland Spider-Man movies in the MCU in the future.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Dread Delgath » Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:47 pm

Anybody remember anything about a Sinister Six movie in the works? I'd rather see that one come out first, then ease into a Venom movie.

But, due to licensing, I'm unsure how a Sinister Six movie would do without Tom Holland's Spidey if it came to that, OR could they make a Sinister Six movie WITH Tom Holland as Spidey?

Honestly, I like Venom, but he's not my favorite. My favorites (aside from the Avengers) have had their shot at the big screen and they either weren't received well, burnt out, or intentionally mishandled and abused. I'd rather see a Sony/Fox/Disney deal to get the big players back into the MCU; Fantastic Four (not the last travesty FF movie that extended their rights over the franchise) and the X-Men.

I'm a die-hard Marvel comics guy from the 70's & 80's, and have been up until Civil War. THESE are the characters & stories I want to see. :?
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:12 pm

Dread Delgath wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:47 pm
Anybody remember anything about a Sinister Six movie in the works? I'd rather see that one come out first, then ease into a Venom movie.

But, due to licensing, I'm unsure how a Sinister Six movie would do without Tom Holland's Spidey if it came to that, OR could they make a Sinister Six movie WITH Tom Holland as Spidey?
I think they are building towards Sinister Six in the Tom Holland movies. In Homecoming we've seen Vulture, Tinkerer, Shocker (x2), Prowler and Scorpion (Cameo). In the sequel we already have confirmed Mysterio, Chameleon and (apparently) Hydroman. The Vulture is also returning..

So I'm thinking they could do a version of the Sinister Six without Venom, assuming the deal is extended.

If the deal comes to an end after the next Spider-Man movie, they might to sinister six with Venom, if the movie is successful.

Honestly, I like Venom, but he's not my favorite. My favorites (aside from the Avengers) have had their shot at the big screen and they either weren't received well, burnt out, or intentionally mishandled and abused. I'd rather see a Sony/Fox/Disney deal to get the big players back into the MCU; Fantastic Four (not the last travesty FF movie that extended their rights over the franchise) and the X-Men.

I'm a die-hard Marvel comics guy from the 70's & 80's, and have been up until Civil War. THESE are the characters & stories I want to see. :?
I am more or less the same as you there. I loved the Black Costume Saga, but when he turned into Venom was sort of the time when I started losing interest in Spider-Man. But at least Venom is a character that I remember from back in the day. I have much less interest in characters that were created later on.

I am looking forward to seeing the Fantastic Four done right finally, and also seeing the X-Men as part of the MCU. :cool:

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by NPCDave » Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:46 pm

I think Sony can use Tom Holland and Spiderman in their own movies including a Sinister Six movie. They can use Spiderman and his villains, so Sony is trying to build their own Spiderverse movie franchise while Marvel gets to use Spiderman in the MCU.

Whether that works or not really depends on how well they write and direct their movies. If I hear high praise about the Venom movie I will see it in theaters, but if not I won't.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:12 pm

NPCDave wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:46 pm
I think Sony can use Tom Holland and Spiderman in their own movies including a Sinister Six movie. They can use Spiderman and his villains, so Sony is trying to build their own Spiderverse movie franchise while Marvel gets to use Spiderman in the MCU.
There's been a lot of speculation about this. There was even talk of Tom Holland appearing in Venom, but now it looks like he won't be. Noone knows the exact details of the current Marvel/Sony arrangement. Personally, I think I dont think Sony can use Spider-Man or any of the characters that appear in shared movies in their own movies untill the arrangement ends. If they could it would give them the ability to dilute the MCU, and I don't see Disney agreeing to something like that. Now, if the deal ends, they can probably do what they want again since they own the rights to the characters. I could be wrong about this, but lack of Spider-Man or characters from Homecoming in Venom does seem to confirm it.

I also think that is why Sony is holding on to the most famous villains for their own movies, although I do like the fact that we are taking a break from the Osbornes, Doc Ock and the other characters we've seen in the Reimi and AMS movies.

Whether that works or not really depends on how well they write and direct their movies. If I hear high praise about the Venom movie I will see it in theaters, but if not I won't.
Yeah, I feel the same way. I'll check out some reviews first.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Kythkyn » Thu Aug 02, 2018 3:00 am

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:53 am

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Seethyr » Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:17 pm

The symbiotes would make some really great D&D monsters/options for PCs. Like the old grafts from 3e, but better.
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:53 pm

Seethyr wrote:
Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:17 pm
The symbiotes would make some really great D&D monsters/options for PCs. Like the old grafts from 3e, but better.
That is *very* interesting!

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Cthulhudrew » Fri Aug 03, 2018 12:35 am

Maybe they could be an advanced/symbiotic version of the Formless Spawn of Tsathoggua?
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Fri Aug 03, 2018 6:02 am

How would you handle it in game though? Like a monster or perhaps a magic item with intelligence ala an intelligent sword?

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Seethyr » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:24 pm

Havard wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 6:02 am
How would you handle it in game though? Like a monster or perhaps a magic item with intelligence ala an intelligent sword?

-Havard
Both good ideas. The latter moreso when used on a character. Perhaps it would have to count as one of the three allowable attuned items.

If you start jockeying around with replacement levels and such, I think you run the risk of the power bloat that 3e was notorious for, but it could be done as well if you’re careful.
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by NPCDave » Tue Oct 09, 2018 1:00 am

So the movie is out, and one of the movie reviewers I trust said...

it was actually good! Not great, not perfect, but much better than you would expect from the trailers.

This Venom has no connection to Spiderman, not even have the white spider silhouette(wait, inverse of a silhouette) on the chest.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Khedrac » Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:45 am

Well I really enjoyed it - as a stand-alone dark comedy.

I think with a lot of comic book adaptations most of the negative reaction comes from comic book fans who are not getting what they expect - and they are being silly imo - the comic is not the film.

Add in to that the rights mess Marvel have made and this was never going to be a spiderman-linked film - Sony own the rights to the spider-verse (all characters started in Spiderman comics) but have done a deal to put spiderman himself back into the MCU, which means anything else they make won't have spiderman links as spiddey is in the MCU... (Except, "Into the Spiderverse" seems to be a way for them to get round that mess.)

Easter Egg warning - there are two sequences in the credits, so don't leave after the first one. Caveat (very minor spoiler) the second one is a sequence from Into the Spiderverse (not one quoted in the trailers I have seen) and so can be ignored if you are not interested in that.
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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by willpell » Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:28 pm

Havard wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:12 pm
That said, it might be interesting if Sony manages to get a sort of parallell Spider-Verse going. They had plans for other movies in this universe such as Silver and Black (Silver Sable and Black Cat), but those plans seem to have been scrapped for now.
The movie Amazing Spider-Man 2 was greatly affected by efforts to make it set up an entire cinematic universe. I don't think it was "ruined" or anything as a result, I found it to be a pretty good movie, but the fact that it's weirdly structured to try and lead up to other movies, which we now will never get, does hamper my enjoyment of it to some extent (it has other problems as well, but enough strengths to be worth its issues).

Personally, I find I prefer Andrew Garfield's portrayal of 20something Peter Parker to be more compelling than Tom Holland's teenage version (although both of them beat the pants off Tobey Maguire; in my opinion all three of the Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies have not aged well - and to bring it back around to the thread topic, since Venom is in it: I think the third film, which seemed to be the worst one when they first came out, may actually be the best in my current opinion).

Not being much of a fan of either Venom or Tom Hardy, I do not care about this particular film at all, other than vaguely hoping that it's commercially successful, just so that more Sony superhero (or supervillain) films will happen.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by Havard » Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:27 pm

willpell wrote:
Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:28 pm
Havard wrote:
Wed Aug 01, 2018 6:12 pm
That said, it might be interesting if Sony manages to get a sort of parallell Spider-Verse going. They had plans for other movies in this universe such as Silver and Black (Silver Sable and Black Cat), but those plans seem to have been scrapped for now.
The movie Amazing Spider-Man 2 was greatly affected by efforts to make it set up an entire cinematic universe. I don't think it was "ruined" or anything as a result, I found it to be a pretty good movie, but the fact that it's weirdly structured to try and lead up to other movies, which we now will never get, does hamper my enjoyment of it to some extent (it has other problems as well, but enough strengths to be worth its issues).
Things have changed a bit in the news since I posted this. I think the chances fo seeing Silver Sable and Black Cat (now separate movies) are still viable as well as Morbius the Living Vampire.

In my opinion, ASM2 was horrible. The intense focus of setting up spin off movies was probably part of the problem, but there were a lot of problems with that movie.
Personally, I find I prefer Andrew Garfield's portrayal of 20something Peter Parker to be more compelling than Tom Holland's teenage version (although both of them beat the pants off Tobey Maguire; in my opinion all three of the Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies have not aged well - and to bring it back around to the thread topic, since Venom is in it: I think the third film, which seemed to be the worst one when they first came out, may actually be the best in my current opinion).
We have different opinions on these movies. I think Spider-Man 2 stands out as one of the best superhero movies of all time. Andrew Garfield was probably one of the best things about those movies though. I agree with you about College Year Spider-Man having a certain appeal, but I think we will get to see Tom Holland move into those years too if Marvel and Sony extend their deal.
Not being much of a fan of either Venom or Tom Hardy, I do not care about this particular film at all, other than vaguely hoping that it's commercially successful, just so that more Sony superhero (or supervillain) films will happen.
I still haven't seen the movie, but if the opening weekend sales (US) are any indication, this movie is going to do very well. It did not do well with critics, but I think this is mainly because it is structurally flawed and apparently has a super boring first act, but there is enough enjoyment in there that many crowds will be pleased.

I do think this means we will see more Sony based superhero movies, whether they will stick with their older plans, or whether they will simply focus on Venom Sequels.

Sony does not hold a high track record when it comes to producing quality movies in recent decades, but more to choose between is always a good thing.

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Re: [Movie] Venom (2018)

Post by willpell » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:18 pm

Havard wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:27 pm
In my opinion, ASM2 was horrible. The intense focus of setting up spin off movies was probably part of the problem, but there were a lot of problems with that movie.
I agree that it has a lot of problems, but IMO it manages to mostly succeed in spite of these. You could make two very good movies out of this one if you split off the parts of the narrative that don't work and then fleshed them out into a new story that is vaguely coherent. The music was particularly awesome, and I really liked the way both the Rhino bookends and Electro as the main villain were handled, with only a few exceptions. I also liked Dane Dehaan's portrayal of Harry Osborn, and if they had put the clearly half-baked Goblin attempt off for another film, they might have managed to make it decent. The Gwen Stacey plotline is likewise so schizophrenic that it really needs to just be chopped in half. But for all its flaws, I think the confused mishmash we got was good enough to be worth forgiving and enjoying.

Amazing 1 was utterly crap, though. Barely watchable, and a supremely disappointing take on one of my favorite Spidey villains. The only scene in it which really worked well was a special-effects-laden action sequence which was clearly completed prior to some rewrites of the overall plot, which effectively ruined the rest of the movie so that only that one scene (which features almost no dialogue) works at all.

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