WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

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Big Mac
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WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Big Mac » Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:46 am

BradyGames published a book called World of Warcraft Dungeon Companion for the WoW MMO. I'm sure it is badly out of date for MMO players, but I'm wondering if it could be useful for tabletop gamers.

There were mixed reviews on Amazon.com, partly because of the content going out of date and partly because you can get the information for free online, if you look around. But there are some copies going cheap and I'm wondering if the dungeon maps could be converted over to tabletop scale and if the lists of monsters within each dungeon could be converted over to 3e stats.
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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by night_druid » Sun Jul 07, 2013 1:12 am

Eh, WOW dungeons tended to be on the "very large" scale, with rooms big enough to fit a small town in. With monster populations to match ;) You'd certainly have to scale back many rooms to reasonable sizes, and reduce the number of creatures by up to a factor of 10. Because rolling for 50 monsters per round would be unmanageable. ;)
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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Teazia » Mon Jul 08, 2013 4:02 am

Ah, that does seem a fun resource- I started playing act the tail end right before TBC and didn't really raid until the classic content was easier mode, but still fun.

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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Big Mac » Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:22 am

night_druid wrote:Eh, WOW dungeons tended to be on the "very large" scale, with rooms big enough to fit a small town in. With monster populations to match ;) You'd certainly have to scale back many rooms to reasonable sizes, and reduce the number of creatures by up to a factor of 10. Because rolling for 50 monsters per round would be unmanageable. ;)
Interesting that you say this, when the general agreement is that MMO populations on the surface are lower than the tabletop requires and need to be scaled up. Not that I disagree with you. But it does kind of means that the MMO is "dungeon heavy" for our requirements.
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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Teazia » Tue Jul 09, 2013 9:01 am

The classic dungeons in Wow are particularly huge. Molten Core and the whole BR mountain instances are ginormous.

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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Big Mac » Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:45 am

Teazia wrote:The classic dungeons in Wow are particularly huge. Molten Core and the whole BR mountain instances are ginormous.
There is a lot of talk in mainstream D&D about megadungeons. Gary Gygax had his and Dave Arneson had his, but we never got to see the entire dungeon. I've got good hopes for Frank Mentzer's mega dungeon - Lich Dungeon, as he actually has control of his own work.

It seems to me that we have the opposite thing going on with the WoW MMO. We have mega-dungeons pre-built, but just do not have the D&D stats to back up the locations, NPCs and monsters.

I've been looking to find a full list of the dungeons covered by this product. I did find this review by Daniel Nelson on Amazon that seems fairly helpful:
Daniel Nelson on Amazon wrote:I think this book is here to help many people. From lowbies who want to go to a dungeon to get their first "Blue" item, to those who are starting to raid Ahn'Qiraj, Zul'Gurub, Molten Core and Blackwing Lair. Even for those who are running a guild, this book is a great help and you can explain the strategies to your fellow members. It describes everything you need to know for an instance dungeon, from quests you have to get before going to the dungeon, items dropped there, rewards for the quests related to that dungeon etc. You can have a sneak view to the guide at Brady Games' official website: [...]

What is the bad? Well, World of Warcraft is an MMORPG, and it can change over time, the drops, the mobs, even the boss strategies can change. However, as we are getting close to the Burning Crusade expansion pack, I don't think the developers will change the 1-60 dungeons since they'll be focusing on the dungeons in the expansion. The other bad thing is this guide doesn't guide you to the brand new dungeon: Naxxramas (which is the hardest dungeon pre-expansion) but Brady Games are good at releasing update for their products.
The "[...]" is Amazon stripping out a URL from a review. :roll: I've searched on the Wayback Machine and can't find the "sneak view of the guide". But at least I know that the guide covers these dungeons:
  • Ahn'Qiraj,
  • Zul'Gurub,
  • Molten Core and
  • Blackwing Lair
But does not cover Naxxramas.

I think the guide might also include other dungeons, as the description on Wowpedia's page for World of Warcraft: Dungeon Companion says that "Light is shed on everything from Ragefire Chasm to Ahn'Qiraj." and Ragefire Chasm is not mentioned above. Mind you, that is taken from the official page.

I'd like to get a look at the contents of this book. (I might actually have to buy it to see what is in it! :lol: )
Last edited by Big Mac on Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by night_druid » Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:56 am

Big Mac wrote:There is a lot of talk in mainstream D&D about megadungeons. Gary Gygax had his and Dave Arneson had his, but we never got to see the entire dungeon. I've got good hopes for Frank Mentzer's mega dungeon - Lich Dungeon, as he actually has control of his own work.
D&D megadungeons are sorta the opposite of WoW megadungeons. D&D megadungeons are enormous labyrinths of hundreds of rooms with an enormous variety of foes, where WOW megadungeons have relatively few, but enormous rooms, a simple layout, and hordes of commonly themed monsters. Also, D&D megadungeons can change over the course of the campaign, as old monsters are slain and new, often different monsters move in. WoW dungeons are static; outside of expansion releases, WoW dungeons will be exactly the same no matter when you enter it. The only difference in the experience is in what loot drops from the bosses.
I've been looking to find
To find...? Kinda trailed off there, BM :)
I'd like to get a look at the contents of this book. (I might actually have to buy it to see what is in it! :lol: )
Well, there's always online sources on every dungeon in the game, so at least you can get the maps and inhabitants. ;)
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Re: WoW Dungeon Companion - Any good for RPG?

Post by Big Mac » Sun Jul 14, 2013 8:14 pm

night_druid wrote:
Big Mac wrote:There is a lot of talk in mainstream D&D about megadungeons. Gary Gygax had his and Dave Arneson had his, but we never got to see the entire dungeon. I've got good hopes for Frank Mentzer's mega dungeon - Lich Dungeon, as he actually has control of his own work.
D&D megadungeons are sorta the opposite of WoW megadungeons. D&D megadungeons are enormous labyrinths of hundreds of rooms with an enormous variety of foes, where WOW megadungeons have relatively few, but enormous rooms, a simple layout, and hordes of commonly themed monsters. Also, D&D megadungeons can change over the course of the campaign, as old monsters are slain and new, often different monsters move in. WoW dungeons are static; outside of expansion releases, WoW dungeons will be exactly the same no matter when you enter it. The only difference in the experience is in what loot drops from the bosses.
If you spend enough time in a MMO dungeon, you will end up meeting the same NPCs, as they return from the dead. But (as usual) I'm talking about raiding MMO stuff and using it for tabletop. So if the PCs cleared out a dungeon and killed the "boss" then those NPCs and their leader would be gone from the game.

You could, for example, run a campaign where the PCs enter Gnomeregan to try to retake parts of the city and pass them back to the gnomes. A lot of that has been removed from the MMO, but an old book (like this one) might provide old information that would work as a dungeon sourcebook.
night_druid wrote:
Big Mac wrote:I've been looking to find
To find...? Kinda trailed off there, BM :)
Ack. I chopped out some stuff there. I've fixed it now. (I was saying how I'd been trying to find out what was actually in the book. I can't remember exactly what I wrote now, but I can't find the contents of the book anywhere and don't know how many dungeons the book covers and how much information would be of use to someone that doesn't want a "MMO levelling guide".)

Knowing who is where would be useful. Knowing what equipment NPCs have could be useful. Being told what spells to cast in order to min-max MMO chances would not be useful.
night_druid wrote:
Big Mac wrote:I'd like to get a look at the contents of this book. (I might actually have to buy it to see what is in it! :lol: )
Well, there's always online sources on every dungeon in the game, so at least you can get the maps and inhabitants. ;)
Sure there is.

But printing out a ton of maps would cost money and this book would appear to have the information collated into a dead tree product that has lost its value to MMO players. Amazon says the book has 464 pages. You can actually buy this for 1 cent + shipping, in the USA, so if the contents are useful enough that could save copying and pasting into word documents and printing stuff out. That is what I'm asking really.
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